The dark side of Theism & Superstition

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CyberLN's picture
I'm sorry for the loss of

I'm sorry for the loss of your friend.

"Faces of death" vids, however, did not cause that death.

As an aside, IMO, suicide is not always the wrong decision to make.

This thread may not cause YOU to take action, however, you are one, not the rest.

ThePragmatic's picture
@ Kafei

@ Kafei

I too am sorry about the loss of your friend.

But just because you are declaring that "We're all aware of this stuff", does not make it so. (I see a reoccurring pattern)

Do you have any idea of how often Theists argue that you need "religion" or "god" to be moral? Do you think that Theists would keep handing their children over to clergy if they were aware of the abuse cases?
Even many non-believers seem to be extremely unaware.

In the U.S alone, the Catholic Church has paid around 4 billion dollars in child abuse settlement. Imagine what that number would be internationally if those sums were available. Imagine what it will be in ten years, now that people are coming forward more and more. Imagine that number, not just for the Catholic Church, but for all of religion. Do you think religious people would be as eager to pay tithing if they realized they were paying for tax exempt child abuse?

- "I don't believe a thread on an atheist forum... ...is necessarily going to cause people to "take action.""

You're free to not "believe" that, all you like.
It's not about trying to make people "take action", it's about awareness. Ignoring a problem, won't make it go away.

I tried to balance things up with another thread: "Uplifting news: humanism, tolerance, science, secularity, etc"
http://www.atheistrepublic.com/forums/debate-room/uplifting-news-humanis...
But unless we want to just read stories about different variants of animals being rescued or rescuing people, it's very very hard to find material for that thread. Feel free to help out.
The only reason that topic has several pages, is because of an unrelated discussion, not because of actual good news.

Rek Init's picture
@Algebe

@Algebe
"I hadn't heard of those until you mentioned them, so I took a look. Thanks for sharing the disease."

I could make a similar argument for the content posted in this thread.

@CyberLN

"Faces of Death" may have not caused his death, but it may influenced him. He had the old orange VHS tapes, and the content you find on those websites Algebe complained about (which are explicit) were saved onto his hard drive. He had dozens of downloads of recordings of actual deaths, suicides, etc. Prior to his death, he developed this fascination. As for "suicide" not always being the "wrong decision to make" is sort of vague comment. Perhaps you're referring to euthanasia for the diseased elderly. I'm really not sure. I suppose I'd agree with you if I knew how you were couching that statement. But I lost two friends to suicide that year six days apart. One on July 4th, 2007, the next on July 6th, 2010. One undergoing a more philosophical depression finding life meaningless, and another going through bullshit; a cheating and pregnant wife, a second DWI, heroin abuse, etc. I'm sure the death of my friend, Adrian, the one that developed the obsession with Faces of Death-type clips affected my other friend on top of all the bullshit he was already dealing with, Robert. I managed to get Robert on the phone that same night, we were going to meet up, and out of intuition my point of discussion was going to be "suicide is not the answer." My wife and mother didn't think I would make to work the next day, and I'd just 40oz the night away with Olde English. I did tell my friend I'd buy 'em. So, I went home with my wife and two kids at the time only to get a phone call the following morning from another close friend who had heard the news that my friend had hung himself.

However, this "take action" comment of yours seem that it would only apply to atheists. You're on an atheist forum, after all, on a single thread which is only highlighting atrocities that seemingly hold religion as the culprit. In other words, a theist would find this thread appalling, and so wouldn't support it. Atheists have always been aware of the corruption of priests and the homosexual and pedophilic charges so much so that it's become a common quip of comedians attacking religion. It's nothing new, and sure, it continues today. I just don't see the point in a thread where The Pragmatic seems to update these things like its a fetishism. As though it was a pastime of his… Really, what's with that? Maybe he has a passionate retort.

This is a tabloid for atheists. 13,650 views so far, and there's how many English people speaking people on the planet with access to Google? What action will be taken that isn't already an effort by atheists? We've got The Atheist Experience webcast, dozens of atheist podcasts, the literature of Dawkins, Harris, Dennett, and Hitchens. The outcry of Greta Christina and various other internet bloggers and social networks. There's the Atheism+ movement. So, you're telling me this thread on Atheist Republic is going to incite people to take action? *Takes another hit of the joint…*

algebe's picture
@Kafei:

@Kafei:
"However, this "take action" comment of yours seem that it would only apply to atheists. You're on an atheist forum, after all, on a single thread which is only highlighting atrocities that seemingly hold religion as the culprit."

As atheists, we often have our morality questioned by theists, who seem to think they have a monopoly on morals. These stories are evidence to the contrary. Having this information allows us to fire a few shots back when theists disrespect us for basing our ethics on something other than their dirty book. We don't all live in a atheist world. We meet theists all the time. They need to know about these crimes.

What is the purpose of the pictures on the sites that you shared? All they told me is that some people had died horrible deaths, often in accidents. They serve no purpose other than prurient gratification.

algebe's picture
http://www.nzherald.co.nz

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=11745043

Horror story from India about child sacrifice and the lynching of "witches"

algebe's picture
" the earth "convulses under

" the earth "convulses under the weight of certain human sin."
http://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/news/national/destiny-churchs-brian-tamaki-b...

This is a Maori evangelist preacher blaming the huge earthquake that hit New Zealand this week on gay people.

ThePragmatic's picture
Saudi Arabia - "A British

Saudi Arabia - "A British tourist has been arrested and charged with illegal “extra-marital sex” in Dubai after telling police she had been gang raped."

Source:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/british-woman-tourist-arr...

ThePragmatic's picture
US - "Donald Trump meets with

US - "Donald Trump meets with creationist Jerry Falwell Jr about possibly becoming next Secretary of Education"

"Jerry Falwell, the President of Liberty University ... the largest Christian school in the country."

Source:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/donald-trump-meets-with-creatio...

Sir Random's picture
Its official. We, the teens

Its official. The teens and kids of the U.S public school system, are intellectually doomed.

ThePragmatic's picture
US - "Trump CIA Pick Mike

US - "Trump CIA Pick Mike Pompeo Depicted War on Terror as Islamic Battle Against Christianity"

Source:
https://theintercept.com/2016/11/23/mike-pompeo-religious-war/

Sounds like a fantastic idea: Bring more religion into a religiously motivated war...

ThePragmatic's picture
US, Baltimore - "The

US, Baltimore - "The Archdiocese of Baltimore has paid a series of settlements to people who allege they were sexually abused by a priest who worked at Archbishop Keough High School decades ago."

"There is a lot of frustration on the part of the survivors as to the amount of money that's being paid in these settlements," Jacobs said, "considering the level of egregiousness and terrible conduct on the part of one man."

"All of the settlements were done out of court because the statute of limitations for people to file civil claims had long since passed, Jacobs said."

"Some state lawmakers have unsuccessfully pushed to extend the statute of limitations. The Catholic Church has opposed such efforts."

Source:
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/baltimore-city/bs-md-maskell-s...

ThePragmatic's picture
US, Kentucky - "Reverend

US, Kentucky - "Reverend Joseph Hemmerle faces charges of sexual abuse and sodomy. In 2001, a man accused the priest of molesting him when he was younger at a Catholic summer camp in Meade County back in the 1970's."

"Hemmerle ran the boys summer camp there for decades.
In 2014, a second victim came forward, and that's when Hemmerle was indicted on the charges."

Source:
http://www.wdrb.com/story/33800251/kentucky-priest-to-stand-trial-on-cha...

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ThePragmatic's picture
"Priest convicted of indecent

"Priest convicted of indecent practices"

"Jurors in the Meade County trial deliberated for two hours before returning the verdict, then recommended a seven-year sentence."

"A second alleged victim, who hasn't been publicly named, will face Hemmerle at trial scheduled for April."

Source:
http://www.star-telegram.com/news/state/texas/article117707378.html

ThePragmatic's picture
Australia, Melbourne - "A

Australia, Melbourne - "A Melbourne Catholic priest has resigned after allegations he sexually abused a trainee priest 30 years ago."

"The ABC revealed that in 2012, the Catholic Church paid $75,000 in compensation to an 18-year-old former student priest, who alleged he was abused by Father John Walshe in 1982."

"Father Walshe strenuously denied the abuse and said the relationship was consensual."

Source:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-11-26/catholic-priest-resigns-after-sex-...

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algebe's picture
I remember this one. He was a

I remember this one. He was a school chaplain until recently. It took concerned parents a year to get the Archbishop to get rid of him. All the people who put money in the church's collection plate must be really pleased to see it going to such a good cause.

ThePragmatic's picture
Canada, Ottowa - "Disgraced

Canada, Ottowa - "Disgraced Ottawa priest accused of sexually assaulting yet another minor"

"Ottawa police said Friday investigators are concerned there could be more potential victims out there."

"The man newly alleging he was victimized by McGrory was 15 years old at the time of the alleged crimes. He lodged a complaint with Ottawa police in September — three months after the Citizen revealed the story of McGrory’s disturbing sexual misdeeds while pastor of the Holy Cross Parish in the 1970s and 80s."

Source:
http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-news/former-ottawa-priest-accused-of...

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ThePragmatic's picture
Norway, Oslo - The Catholic

Norway, Oslo - The Catholic diocese is required to pay back 4.6 million dollars and is fined 116 000 dollars for fraudulently submitting false memberships to gain more government funding.

Employees of the diocese have during the period from 2011 to 2014 used the telephone directory to find people with "Catholic-sounding names" (apparently primarily polish and spanish names), then obtained their personal identity numbers, and then used that to declare their membership numbers when applying for government funding.

Source:
http://www.dagbladet.no/nyheter/en-million-i-bot-til-oslo-katolske-bispe...

ThePragmatic's picture
Canada, Ottawa - "Archdiocese

Canada, Ottawa - "Archdiocese of Ottawa paid altar boy $50,000 to keep quiet about priest who allegedly molested him"

"...instead of defrocking Rev. Jacques Faucher, church officials reassigned him to duties that would keep him away from children.
Documents newly obtained by Postmedia show the diocese wrote a $50,000 cheque to the man in 1998, more than a year after he told the church about the alleged sexual abuse.
The payment was made on the condition he keep details of the out-of-court settlement confidential."

Source:
http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada/archdiocese-of-ottawa-paid-alta...

The old "sweep it under the rug" tactic... who would have guessed?

ThePragmatic's picture
"What do atheists tell their

"What do atheists tell their children?" - Toma Haiku, a Christian blogger lays out the "truth" for us.

The picture says it clearly: "Your life is pointless, you have no spirit, deal with it"

What an unbelievable level of ignorance displayed by some Christian blogger who is blogging "the truth". It's very clear he has no idea what he is writing about, yet he lectures others and speaks "truth":

http://www.tomahaiku.com/what-do-atheists-tell-their-children/

A taste of his ignorance combined with mad assumptions:

- "In the beginning there was nothing but a large rock floating through space, right? It exploded, and over billions of years the universe was formed."

Wtf? Unbelievable ignorance!

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ThePragmatic's picture
Russia, Tatarstan - "The

Russia, Tatarstan - "The Russian Orthodox Church’s archdiocese in Tatarstan has published exciting new research indicating that the Bible shows dinosaurs existed as recently as 2,000 years ago, meaning they walked the Earth alongside men like Plato, Julius Caesar, and even Jesus Christ."

Source:
https://themoscowtimes.com/news/russian-archdiocese-publishes-article-sa...

ThePragmatic's picture
This is a good example of how

This is a good example of how people take advantage of those inclined to believe on faith

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ThePragmatic's picture
The Vatican - Pontifical

The Vatican - Pontifical Commission on Child Protection creates website

Well pardon my french, but whoopty fuckin' doo...

"a Commission of experts to act as an advisory body to the Holy Father for the protection of minors and vulnerable adults"

So, it's a group of "experts" who are going to advise the Pope. Hallelujah praise the lord god jesus amen!
It's not even a band aid for people who got abused and raped, it's a group of religious people holding meetings and praying?!

Okay, okay...
Maybe I'm being to judgemental here. I'll try to give them the benefit of doubt...

"Prayer is a central, important part of the healing process for victims/survivors and for the whole community of believers."

Aaaah! Come on, wtf?!

How hard would it be for the Vatican to make a huge difference for victims and preventing further abuse? They have enormous resources in terms of money, power and people.

Their good-for-nothing hypocritical website:
http://www.protectionofminors.va/content/tuteladeiminori/en.html

ThePragmatic's picture
Argentina, Buenos Aires – "at

Argentina, Buenos Aires – "at least 22 children were sexually abused by two priests at a school for youths with hearing disabilities in northwestern Mendoza province."
"Police arrested 82-year old priest Nicola Corradi, 55-year-old priest Horacio Corbacho"
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2016/12/05/argentina-prosecutor-priests-abu...
http://wtop.com/latin-america/2016/12/victim-advocates-pope-told-of-prie...

US - The Vatican quietly reinstated priest accused of sex abuse, among other positions, as chaplain to a youth group. Gugliotta, 54, remains jailed in Pennsylvania in lieu of $1 million bail.
http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2016/12/priest_in_child_porn_case_had_p...

Australia - "Catholics sorry that a priest abused a disabled woman" (For 14 years)
http://www.smh.com.au/national/investigations/church-apology-for-a-14yea...

Australia - "More than 80 Catholic and Anglican Church priests and other representatives – including women - are alleged to have committed child sex crimes against Hunter children over decades"
"newly released data analysis and evidence to the Royal Commission"
http://www.smh.com.au/national/royal-commission-reveals-more-than-80-chu...

algebe's picture
I can understand (though

I can understand (though never forgive) the actions of the individuals concerned. They are weak, worthless, pathetic men driven by urges they can't control. Only in a church could such filth ever rise to positions of responsibility.

The actions of the Catholic and Anglican organizations in appointing, protecting, transferring and hiding these scum are crimes against humanity on a vast scale. They are doubly evil because children are being harmed. The Catholics, Anglicans, Salvation Army, Methodists, etc., are guilty of organized criminal activities that would make Al Capone blush with same. They should be prosecuted mercilessly in every jurisdiction. If individual countries can't do it, the Pope, the Archbishop of Canterbury and all the other godfathers should be dragged to the International Court of Justice.

watchman's picture
@ The Pragmatic....

@ The Pragmatic....

In my opinion..the whole criminal enterprise should be held in utter contempt until the number of predatory priests/ nuns ,turned over to the legal authorities ,by the RCC itself ,begins to (even distantly) approach the numbers of abuse cases raised.

Until then ,as far as I'm concerned ,they are still at the back of the queue of those awaiting to be re-admitted to the human race.

Just a couple of legal terms for any outraged catholics out there....

1/ Accessory before the fact...... A person who aids, abets, or encourages another to commit a crime but who is not present at the scene. An accessory before the fact, like an accomplice, may be held criminally liable to the same extent as the principal. ...

2/.Accessory after the fact.....Someone who assists another 1) who has committed a felony, 2) after the person has committed the felony, 3) with knowledge that the person committed the felony, and 4) with the intent to help the person avoid arrest or punishment. An accessory after the fact may be held liable for, inter alia, obstruction of justice.

3/ Complicity....... Complicity in criminal law refers to when someone is legally accountable, or liable for a criminal offence, based upon the behaviour of another. Criminal complicity may arise in the following situations: With the intent to promote or assist the commission of the offence

ThePragmatic's picture
Good to know. At least there

Good to know. At least there are two of us who recognizes the problem. :)

ThePragmatic's picture
Ghana - A bishop claims to be

Ghana - A bishop claims to be able to make men’s penises larger by massaging their groins with his hands.

Daniel Obinim has been filmed performing a ritual where he moves around a room full of men, grabbing them each by the crotch.

Graciously, he also offers to massage women’s breasts in order to enlarge them too.

"If you do not like the looks of any part of your body, come to me"

http://metro.co.uk/2016/12/06/bishop-claims-to-make-mens-penises-larger-...

This is the Bishop who has been charged with physical abuse after flogging two young adults a few months back...

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SeanBecker's picture
I'm sorry that that exists, I

I'm sorry that that exists, I guess it's just a representation of the evil people will do to scare people into religion. All we can do is spread awareness, and any children that we may have, give them a free choice of religion.

ThePragmatic's picture
US - The Catholic Church is

US - The Catholic Church is at it again, trying to block the change the Statute of Limitations on Sex Assault.

That god sure works in mysterious ways...

"Both Allred and Grosso pointed to the Catholic Church as one of the opponents of the legislation."
"... the Catholic Church has opposed similar legislation in other states."

"Advocates for victims of sex assault say there shouldn’t be any limits on justice. A movement to eliminate or extend statutes of limitations has gained momentum across the country."

Source:
http://www.nbcwashington.com/blogs/first-read-dmv/Bill-Cosby-Accuser-Mee...

ThePragmatic's picture
Australia, - "A FORMER

Australia, - "A FORMER Anglican priest who sexually preyed on two young boys before moving to the Diocese of Grafton has been jailed for at least one year and 10 months."

Less then 2 years?

"McLoughlin carried out the sexual attacks while employed in the Diocese of Newcastle."

"McLoughlin was linked to former senior priest Peter Rushton, whom a royal commission has heard ran a child sex ring from the Hunter region of New South Wales."

Sources:
http://www.southburnetttimes.com.au/news/former-grafton-priest-jailed-fo...
http://www.theherald.com.au/story/4342565/rushton-partner-admits-to-abuse/

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