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Exactly. We should be the best representations of the "Ideal", in this case Jesus. For others their ideal is to live forever, fountain of youth, cure for death, "works" mentality (doing your best).
Christians will never be the 'Ideal' of Jesus but catch 22 is to be the best they can while still pointing others to the 'Ideal'.
No man does anything different on this earth. None.
Well to give as simple of an answer as I can muster. The first problem is that of the distinction between the history of Christianity and the narrative of Christianity or to say that which is claimed to have happened, vs what ACTUALLY happened. Which is largely ignored by Christians as a whole. For example one narrative within Christianity is that of the Israelis exodus out of Egypt, which has a very significant role to play in the narrative at large. Within the book of Exodus Moses wanders through the desert for quite some time before reaching Mount Sinai and forming a Covenant with God, receiving the 613 laws found in Deuteronomy and Leviticus(more to the point of this is that the first five books of the bible are called the Torah which means the Law) and then solidifying this covenant through mass circumcision. Later we see that Jesus claims to come to fulfill this covenant and even adds that not one law shall pass until all is fulfilled.
Now in the history of Christianity, the accounts of Exodus never took place, as has been confirmed by multiple archeology departments from multiple universities. so if the accounts of exodus never took place, then Jesus in fact had nothing to fulfill in the first place so any claims he made based on a covenant that was never formed renders those claims null in void snd therefore Christianity as a religion is wrong. There are many examples I could give but I'll end it there. I look forward to your response.
I am an agnostic, and I grew up as a Christian girl in Slovakia. My parents were not too religious (we would go to Church maybe once or twice a year) but at home, religion was seldom discussed. However, the school that I went to was a Catholic school, and this is where I got my dose of Christianity. I do not take the bible too literally, because it does not make a whole lot of sense. When I was younger it did, but as I got older and was introduced to the whole concept of evolution, I quickly realized that there are quite a few "holes" in the teachings of the bible, and religion in general. I also do not agree with all of the moral teachings.
One thing I really did not like about Christianity is the pressure that these groups attempt to give someone to ensure that they do not "think outside the box". There was too much talk about punishments if one fails to believe.
Overall, I think that contrary to what most people would say on here, the bible and Christianity itself in general has positive aspects. I think that it does attempt to teach people how to be "good". However, I think that these rules apply to what was familiar to the religious world at the time during which the bible was constructed. It made sense to people, gave them an answer as to how they and their ancestors got to earth, it also made people feel special. The threats such as eternal punishment were likely used to control barbaric peoples. Although the bible has some positive aspects to it, there are many inconsistencies with reality. I do not believe that the earth is only a few thousand years old, look at fossils, and that is debunked. I do not believe in talking snakes, people living in whales, and I have a hard time believing that anyone could resurrect from the dead. I'm not saying that I can't be persuaded to believe these things, but I need real evidence. Because I was practicing the faith almost everyday of my life more many years at my school, I do at times have a hard time dismissing it. However, these are a few of the problems I have with it. The faith could be 100% correct, but there is certainly a lack of evidence to back this up, so that is why I am skeptical about its claims.
I think George Carlin said it better than I'll ever be able to:
George Carlin was fantastic! He really covered a lot of ground there!
I don't have a problem. I simply don't believe Christians when they tell me how awesome Jesus is and how sunny their life is with Jesus in their heart. Nothing more boring than Christian testimonies.
I don't have a problem with Christianity itself.
As far as why I recently stopped believing in God, I don't really know where to start. I guess what never made sense to me as a child is, why was it necessary for God to have his son tortured and murdered for the concept of grace to be born? Why couldn't God just simply stop being such a tyrant? If he's all powerful, he can certainly manage that. Furthermore, an all knowing God would never be in the wrong hence, would never need to "change gears". God is supposed to be all knowing, and we're supposed to trust in him regardless of the fact that there's more than one occasion in the bible where he changes his mind about one thing or another. I've heard some very acrobatic theological explanations for this, but none even approached adequacy.
I also never had this supernatural experience that those around me appeared to be having. There were times when I would exaggerate an experience to convince myself I was saved, but eventually I realized that these people were all just lying to themselves like I was.
Then there's the discrepancy between how old the earth is and how old the bible claims it is. I don't think elaboration is necessary on this one.
I do have a problem with how Christianity is used by politicians and in public policy. Most Christians I know claim that the constitution does not separate church and state. I don't believe this is the case, but I also don't think it matters. They probably wrote the thing with with a bowl of ink and a feather so I don't automatically assume that it can't be improved upon. And this idea that we need to teach creationism in Science class is absolutely ridiculous. I also think it's odd that the most racist regions in the country are the most religious as well.
If you're looking for versus, I'll give you a horrifying one from Christ himself. This is the guy who supposedly created the doctrine of grace:
Luke 19:27
"I tell you that everyone who has will be given more; but the one who does not have, even what he has will be taken away from him. 27 And these enemies of mine who were unwilling for me to rule over them, bring them here and slay them in front of me.’”
Sorry about the scatterbrained nature of this post. I'm doing to many things at a time. Hope this helps!
Algebe hit the nail right on the head when saying:
"What Christianity tells us, and what Christians have done throughout history, is to make sure that you persecute the right people."
It is the religion of finding a scapegoat to pay for your fear of what the man in the sky thinks of you.
I have Christian friends. When I converse with Christian acquaintences, we may talk about how we live our lives and I can always bet I'll eventually hear them say "Well I'm a Christian". Well. I'm. A. Christian. So contemptuous. How dare you Imply that you all are immune to being called out for your mistakes, have a monopoly on morals, and can sin as much as they want because you all can just be "saved" afterwards?
No dude. No. You guys can't do what you want and condemn everyone else because they don't buy this stuff or because their books feature different characters. No bible quotes needed, just the amount of progress humanity has NOT made because of religion (Christianity being the most widespread) is enough of a reason.
Until a theist proves the existence of a god or gods, all religions are, by definition, mythology and misguided wishful thinking.
Christianity is simply one of the more notable belief systems amongst all belief systems that are wholly unnecessary to the worship of a claimed god figure. You might say that such belief systems are idol worship, which is not at all a stretch, considering the sheer weight of numbers defending them as if they were protecting the god itself. But, go figure, logic isn't involved.
The key question regarding belief systems I'd pose to their adherents is - Can you hold your god dear and worship it without channeling it through your chosen/conscripted belief system? If not, then you are idol worshiping and placing your belief system before your god.
Whatever, I really don't care how an adherent to a belief system explains/excuses himself or if he does at all. That's the part that keeps my atheism in good stead.
I'm not sure what you mean by belief system. If you mean tradition, and what catholic's do, I don't.
there is total confusion in the Christian churches, the self righteousness of the fundamentalist to the word of faith teachers to roman Catholicism to some religious getting involved and mixing religion with politics.what a dreadful time for religion.i am an agnostic I left Christianity where I experienced all of the above. I would not go back to Christianity any more, I enjoy the freedom of being some what in the middle of the hysteria.the prosperity gospel of mike Murdoch and others is very disturbing they take what I see biblical verses out of context, give and you will receive 60 100 fold running over, this is total nonsense on there part, by the way do you see how they live there mansions there cars there private jets.They have funneled there followers, it is one big business today.also I found out that religion does not make men virtuous as Bertrand Russell stated years ago, there are a whole lot of hypocrites in the church, The pastors are wolves in sheep clothing. this is just a few reasons I feel that Christianity is wrong.
Unknown
So did was God the mind that supposedly created the covenants that sanction the murder of adulterers, homosexuals etc?
So, UnKnown, we weren't meant to fully understand the bible. Now I have heard everything! I call bullshit on that! The bible is a propaganda book meant to cause obedience of the masses to work for the few. Kinda like how street gangs make a set of rules for the members to follow or else!
I've been out of the loop for a while, but here's quite a few examples with my problems of Christianity, religion as a whole and other superstitious beliefs:
http://www.atheistrepublic.com/forums/debate-room/dark-side-theism-super...
WB, Prag!
TY :)
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