Haven't thought about it for a while, but the fear came back today, I just need reassurance, this NDE seems hard to explain. A patient was dying, kept having a flag eeg, coming to, blacking out, coming to and said everytime he was "out" he saw hell. Then Rawlings, a medical doctor told him to pray and say he believed in Jesus, suddenly the guy's eeg went flat again, he saw heaven. He also became an evagalist. Does this prove hell?
"Rawlings told the story of his patient who collapsed during a stress test, and “before we could stop the machine, he dropped dead.”
Well, apparently not completely dead, because in the patient’s own words,
“When I came to, Dr. Rawlings was giving me CPR, and he asked me what was the matter, because I was looking so scared. I told him that I had been to hell and I need help! He said to me, ‘keep your hell to yourself, I’m a doctor and I’m trying to save your life, you need a minister for that.’ … And I would fade out every so often, so then he would focus CPR again and bring me back…Whenever I would come back to my body, I kept asking, “Please help me, please help me, I don’t want to go back to hell.” Soon a nurse named Pam said, “He needs help, do something!” At that time, Dr. Rawlings told me to repeat this short prayer. “I believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God. Jesus, save my soul. Keep me alive. If I die, please keep me out of hell!”
The experience of the patient, Charles McKaig, then became pleasant, and he reported seeing his deceased mother and stepmother and being surrounded and comforted by the Holy Spirit. Upon awakening, he was an immediate evangelical Christian.
In Rawlings words, “After this was all over, I realized what really happened. It was a double conversion. Not only had this make-believe prayer converted this atheist … it had also converted this atheist doctor that was working on him”
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*grooooooan*.....*double face palm*...... C'mon, RT! Really??? Tell me something, dude. If I were to tell you I had an NDE and found myself in a room full of beautiful scantily-clad ladies with Jesus standing at the door wearing a Huggy Bear pimp-daddy coat and hat with wingtip shoes, smoking a cigar, counting a large wad of money in his hand and telling me, "Your choice of any girl in here for only five dollars," would you believe me? If so, then maybe it is possible I had a very vivid dream last night that God Himself spoke directly to me and told me he wants you to send me all of your money and worldly possessions. And it must have been real, because I saw Pearly Gates behind him, with a bunch of angels flying around everywhere, and we were standing on a big, white, fluffy cloud. Should I send you my address?
RT back at it again with his delusion T-man.....hahahah.....*i just swallowed my gum by the way while reading this post*
RT..i miss yah bruh...and i miss your relentless belief about NDE's....
hi everyone...oh yeah..hi T-ma-man...whats up with AR?? i see a lot of new folks coming in....
Q! How goes it, bro? Yeah, RT decided to pay us another visit. It's that time again, I suppose. *chuckle* And there are a couple of new faces around, but some of the regulars have been rather scarce lately. Good to see you back.
Charles probably has a long-lost cousin in Nigeria who recently died with an estate worth $64 million dollars.
The way I see it, for hell and heaven to be real, talking snakes, virgins giving births, a dude living in a whale for a few days, a giant ship built by a 600 year old man with 2 of every animal on the ship because Yahweh got mad so he decided to flood the earth, need to be real as well. Honestly hell is the last thing I’ll worry about on my death bed
Righto, the person did not actually die, and their brain didn't rot away in the short amount of time as per the incident described. So their brain was still working, but abnormally, though perfectly NATURALLY for a person near death. It seems highly likely that the person's brain was under stress, during the incident, maybe lacking some peripheral inputs, maybe short of oxygen. Weird things may have gone on in the brain. Upon final recovery, the person's brain had to try and make sense of a highly abnormal situation, and the person articulated the result of that. The person no doubt had an idea of the concept of heaven and hell, (a cultural thing - described in art works etc. for example). So the brain tried to make sense of it in those terms.
But the brain is good at making mistakes - think of optical and auditory illusions. I presume you' heard of the Yanny / Laurel auditory illusion.
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In Texas recently a cloud was photographed. It looked like an angel . . .
https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/38033404_22656780868...
But it was only a cloud, not a manifestation of an angel. People see Mickey Mouse, and Donald Duck, and all sorts of oddball stuff in cloud formations.We see patterns in things, where no pattern is really there, (it's not us SEEING them, it's our brains trying to make sense of the inputs it's getting).
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Star constellations like vaguely like images . . .
https://cdn1.vectorstock.com/i/1000x1000/62/30/night-sky-with-scorpius-c...
BUT . . .
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QUOTE
UNIVERSE GUIDE
Scorpius, the scorpion constellation facts and mythology
@
"The distance to Scorpius is not calculable because all the stars that make up the constellation are at various distances:
@
https://www.universeguide.com/constellation/scorpius
So the "image" that is the constellation Scorpius, for example is a bunch of stars a long way apart from us, seeming to form a shape.
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The brain constructs reality for us, and often gets it wrong. No wonder people who come back from near death, report weird experiences, but it is MOST likely that their brains are doing what brains do, constructing a faulty version of reality, (actually an unreality).
@ Mutorc S'yriah
Would you say that even if people report NDEs as feeling "more real than real life" or "like reality on steroids" that it still doesn't mean the brain couldn't have created the experience?
@ RT
Have you ever had a dream, Neo. A dream where you could not distinguish reality from the dream?
rmfr
@Russian-Tank
My NDE was a very intense dream. We all have dreams that are very vague and fuzzy, forgotten the instant we wake up, and at the other extreme, very intense dreams that definitely leave memories behind. Dreams come in various intensities.
What you should do is compare this version of events; with the statements of the others involved (you know; the ones who weren't making money from the story/book).
@ Russian Tank
Here is an excerpt from my essay "Soul Shatter"
Near Death Experience? My Ass!
==================================
As far as I am concerned, Near Death Experiences (NDE) are nothing more than a pile of horse hoowhee. I have been in a NDE and I saw nothing. And if you think I am only saying this to get back at religion and its Absolutists, then go back and read the Soul Shatter section. This time REALLY read it. Truly cogitate what is written there. Then come back...
I have been in a NDE. Was in it for 26 days, 16 days coma, and 10 days medically induced coma. As I said, I saw nothing to prove the existence that any NDE ever occurs. And I was as close to death as anyone can get without actually dying. Yes, according to the doctors, my heart stopped a couple of times, but they got it restarted (Duh). Don’t know about the EEG. I never asked. Did not care. At the time, all I wanted (once awake and coherent) to know was where my wife and daughters were.
Basically, for all of you out there who have had what you may call a NDE did nothing but suffer an oxygen deprivation hallucination inside that fallible brain of yours. Prove me wrong. And, yes, even I shall admit that my brain is also fallible. I’d be an idiot not to.
And here is more proof as to why all NDEs are nothing but bullshit. Paraphrasing from something I read on the WWW, probably at Atheist Republic, “Why is it we never hear about any NDEs about this place of fire and brimstone? Why are NDEs only supposedly about this place of light and peace?” I know, I know, it is God trying to show someone it and heaven does exist, and sends them back to prove it to us. However, this where proof that your God is also incredibly stupid. It only uses hearsay of a fallible human being. And even It should realize that hearsay is the worst possible form of evidence.
I have also read quite a few medical journal papers on the effects of oxygen deprivation of the brain. You do know what a centrifuge is? Those things with the rotating arms they study pilots with? Well, many of those pilots, when pushed to point of passing out, reported having the same exact hallucinations as persons who suffered these so-called NDEs. EXACTLY the same. Thus, those NDEs were also hallucinations.
Just to show you. Many decades ago, while I was in the Navy on our 14 month mission, I saw a march of Emperor Penguins near one of our DEW stations up in Greenland. Although I have no photos and no one else can corroborate my story, I stand by the fact that it is true.
That is hearsay. Is what I say the truth, or am I making it up? Want to truly know something, you cannot prove either way. You cannot prove I am telling the truth. Nor can you prove I am telling a lie. This is the whole premise of your God Hypothesis. He cannot be proven to exist. Nor can he be proven not to exist. However, when it comes to your God, I am exactly like what Neil deGrasse Tyson once said on the subject (and I paraphrase): “I am just not convinced. The evidence does not exist to prove there is a God.”
In my above story, there is one fact that can be used to disprove it. The Emperor Penguin does NOT exist north of the equator. However, that fact still does not disprove the fact that I may have seen a march of them up in Greenland. I can still always say, “Well, I know what I saw. You weren’t there.”
And before you think me insane, no, the story of the penguins is FALSE. I was just making a point on the fallacy and unfalsifiability of hearsay evidence.
And since I do not feel like trying a search on these forums, hear is the NDE I actually suffered...
BTW: Nyarlathotep, we need a better search engine for JUST these forums. The one suggested method using that sorry POS google does not work. I can find stuff faster reading goat eviscera than using google.
A Story of My Visit With “God”
==================================
Sorry. Apology made. I lied in the section above. I did have a Near Death Experience. Here is that story.
There was once I thought I had died. At least I think I did. I can remember this horrible screaming and a tumbling, then all goes black. After who can know how long, a light appeared. Funny, I thought to myself, this is familiar. Then the light appeared to move closer. As it came closer, or I was moving towards it, it seemed to be coming from the far off opening of a tunnel. Curious, I began moving towards that light. Then it dawned on me why this seemed so familiar. It looks exactly like all those Near Death Experience (NDE) stories I have heard and read about.
Wow, am I dead? I thought.
As I was approaching the light, I could see what appeared to be three persons moving about in the light. However, the shapes were exceptionally vague. As if they were not completely coherent. As if not fully formed.
At this time I am thinking to myself, What the hell is going on? Am I hallucinating? Am I dreaming? I use the standard idiot test of pinching myself, already knowing this ain't gonna prove anything. But I do it anyway.
Finally, I arrive and enter into the light. Whoa, I think. That was a trip. I can now see clearly as if it were nothing more than a clear, sunny day. However, there is no sun, just light. It is as if I am floating, suspended. Yet, I can move wherever I wish just by thinking about it.
Once I am into the light, I look. I am dumbfounded. There in front of me are my wife and twin daughters. What the hell..., I think.
“Sweetheart,” my wife says as she closes for a hug. “Dad!” my daughters yell as they do the same. I almost succumb to the group hug and give in to the all too real emotions. However, being the onerous skeptic I have always been, I snap out of it. I release them and look deeply at them.
“Where are we?” I ask.
“Sweetheart,” my wife says and places a gentle hand at my ear. “This is The Precipice.”
“Precipice?” I ask.
“Yes, this is the Precipice before one enters into the Presence of God. What most people call Heaven.”
I am dumbfounded. Why am I here? I think. I have never believed in any of this.
“How,” I begin to ask, but she moves her hand to still my lips.
“Yes. We were all atheist in that life. It seems it actually matters not whether we believe or not in that life, but what we believe. Once the corporeal existence is over, we all come to the Precipice first. Then we enter into the Presence of God before coming to the Throne of Judgment.”
“I still don’t understand,” I say.
“Come. You shall.”
We then move deeper into the light. As we are moving, I can feel this complete awe, a something, a presence washing through me. It is almost as if I am now coming truly alive for the very first time. It almost feels as if I am being imbued with such power that only God should possess.
Then we come to a throne so huge it seems as if it could span complete continents, if it were on the Earth. And upon that Throne...
“Welcome,” an all immense voice says, coming from everywhere, yet also seeming to come from nowhere.
“Whom may you be?” I ask.
“I AM THAT I AM,” the Presence says.
Great, ask a stupid question...
“Why am I here? I have never believed in any of this,” and I spread my arms to encompass all.
“You are here because this is where all living things come after their corporeal life has ended,” the Presence says. “They all come here regardless.”
After a pause of some time, “And...” I say.
“And I am the Crux of All. I am that which Brings Balance to That Which Exists. I am the Center of All Things. I am the Creator of The First Universe.”
“But I have never believed in anything like your existence,” I say.
“Of that I already know. And I now ask, why did you choose not to believe?”
“Lack of evidence. Virtually everything the Absolutists say about you is immoral and preposterous,” I say. Then continuing, “Besides, have you read those books they have about you?”
“What books?” the Presence asks, almost as if it already knows the answer.
“One is called the Bible. Then there is the Qu’ran, the Torah, the Talmud, the Bhagavad Gita, and there are probably hundreds of others.”
“Ah, you mean the collections of horror stories written by frightened primitive humans. Yes, I know of those books. I had nothing to do with what is written inside any of them. You see, they have it all wrong. All I have done is to create the structure of the Multiverse to hold all the universes within, of which they are infinite. I only sit at the Crux of All the Universes. I only created the First Universe, from whence you have come. After creating the First Universe, I left it alone. I let it become whatsoever it may. After the creation, I have had nothing to do with the First Universe.”
“In other words, you basically left it to the Theory of Evolution,” I said.
“Yes. That is an apt description, albeit, ultimately incorrect,” the Presence replied. For some reason, it almost feels as if the Presence smiles, knowing who I am more so than I know myself.
“One thing you must understand is that an entity such as I that possesses the Ultimate Power of Creation also possesses the Ultimate Power of Destruction and can do nothing with his creation once created, except to destroy it. Essentially, there are only two things an entity such as myself can do: Create, or Destroy. I cannot nurture, I cannot aid, I cannot prohibit, I cannot interfere with that which I may create. If I were to reach into my creation to do anything, then my own Ultimate Power would utterly destroy that creation. If I so desire, I could send others back, such as yourself, since you now possess that Power, but of a much lesser degree, and you could do things within my creation. You could eventually bring about its utter destruction if you so wish. But even that would require much work and expenditure of your Power.
“And once there, to them, you would seem to be an angel. A being of mighty power.”
“Have you sent others back?” I ask, interrupting.
“No. Once all those whom have found the truth about the Ethereal Existence of Eternity, all have chosen to exist within their own realm. Their own universe.”
“Thus, the reason why there never has been any evidence. I can understand that. If I am given the Power and opportunity to spend this Ethereal Existence of Eternity with my family wherever I may wish, I would not want to return to that shit-hole for any reason.”
“And we had to come here from ours in order to be with you,” my wife says.
“Yeah, it was kind of growing dull being with the Simulacrum of you we had created. We wanted the Real You,” my daughters added in stereo as was their wont.
“Exactly. Ultimately, those, like you and your family, always show themselves to be worthy of this Power. It is persons such as yourself who choose not to believe in power, who choose not to seek for power, who choose not to possess power, ultimately prove to be the most worthy of the Power itself. Such are those who would actually not use the Power except to create their universe of existence in which to spend Eternity.”
“But what about this Satan being all those Absolutists are always eluding to?” I ask.
“A fantasy. A personification for them to use to convince others they need to be controlled without actually saying they need to be controlled. And before you ask... Yes, ALL things come from me when I created the First Universe. Good, Evil, Love, Hate, Light, Darkness. Everything. For you must also understand that not even Nothing itself can exist unless its equal, yet opposite, counterpart also exists. And, yes, that means you cannot have Something unless you also have Nothing. That is why I am the Crux, the Balance, for all that exists.
“Those who choose to seek power over others, they are the ones who prove to be the most unworthy. They are the ones who ultimately receive the Ultimate Death of Non-Existence. For they have already chosen to have their heaven within the corporeal existence.”
Then He pauses to look at me. It is almost as if He were looking into me.
“Yes. The ones you call Absolutists, especially the inexorable ones, but perhaps not all to whom you refer with that term, are the primary ones who seek power over others. To have their heaven within their corporeality. They seek to enslave and to control others. Seek to sap their mental will. Sap their mental faculties for free thought. And once they control the will, they continue to sap them for more and more control and power. Mostly in the form of beguiling theft of what is called money. And they tend to also do this through political offices where they exert their power and control to pass laws to favor their abilities and desires for even more power while in the corporeal world. They are the ones who create these fantasies about the true nature of Eternity. Those like you and your family tend to be more reasonable and more rational about everything. You still may not have it correct, but you Rationalists are usually as close to true as any of you can get.
“And, No. The corporeal life you had is not a test to see about your worthiness. Well, that is not exactly true either. Basically, it is the corporeal existence one makes for themselves which will also dictate the ethereal existence you will possess in Eternity. In other words, what you have made of life in your corporeal existence is also the life you shall have in the Ethereal Existence of Eternity. In other words, you now have the Power to create your own existence, your own universe within the multiverse, within Eternity. Whatever you may wish is yours.”
And then I look to my wife and twin daughters, seeing the smiles on their faces, and the light begins to fade. I can only hope we are going to my idea of my heaven...
And then... Everything is a blurred fog. My mind a nebulous fugue. A floating blob of liquid glass. A spider web over my body. A blur of white. Then, fade to black...
============================================================
Since the re-writing of this essay, I found this video on YouTube: The Greater Insult. It is worth watching, no matter your beliefs. As unbelievable as it may seem, I wrote the above before I found DarkMatter2525’s video.
I also found this Power Corrupts series a short time later. Funny how the simulation world Jeffrey describes in one of the episodes is somewhat similar to our own reality...
See. NDEs are like "simple solutions." Where I come from in SENCNESC, we have a saying, "Simple solutions, ain't."
rmfr
So is this published by someone reputable, or is the bit you posted here just part of a draft?
It doesn't prove Hell exist. All nde's are, is the brain not receiving enough oxygen. Can you prove Hell is real? Can you prove Heaven is real?
So a personal account by a person (who is also profoundly religious and believes in hell) in severe medical distress is proof? I have seen people whacked out on LSD who also told weird stories. And everyone understood that they were hallucinations.
Welcome back Russian Tank. But you really should look for proof, not wild stories by people who are not fully sane.
If I had an NDE and told you a story about a three-headed giraffe, would you believe there are giraffes with three heads? Of course not, and I don't expect you to. So don't believe any story from anyone who had an NDE.
An NDE is just a crazy dream. Just a dream. Just a figment of an imagination, at best.
If it were ethical to run experiments with NDEs, then it would be interesting and might produce some reliable data. Ethics kills a lot of science.
Your spiel about NDEs being dreams is unsubstantiated nonsense precisely because we don't have room to run experiments here.
@Calhai: Ethics kills a lot of science
That's something for which we should all be grateful, given the horrors perpetrated by people like Mengele and Unit 731.
To do NDE experiments, we'd need to "kill" people medically and then bring them back, as portrayed in the movie "Flatliners". Some of the subjects probably wouldn't make it back, so no ethics committee is ever going approve experiments on human subjects.
That means we're limited to anecdotes by people who claim to have had NDEs. As far as I know, there have been no cases in which a purported NDE subject came back with knowledge or abilities that they could not have otherwise gained. Also, the religious imagery reported always seems to be based on the subject's own cultural background. Post-NDE subjects may also be prompted by people eager for confirmation of their own beliefs, or by people offering money for tabloid stories.
None of it really adds up to a convincing case for a scientific study, even without the ethics limitations.
I suspect that with the legalization of assisted suicide, some patients may be willing to participate in end-of-life studies, and some ethics committees might consider allowing NDE studies. It is, as I've now written three times here, in three different ways--and I emphasize that this agrees with your claims--experimentally improper to conclude anything ontological from the available data on NDEs.
@ calhais
One does not have to murder people to study NDE's.
Each day people die under controlled conditions, in hospitals and facilities that offer palliative care. All that is required is a large enough sample size to reach reasonable assumptions.
I do not know why you think the only way to do research is to murder people. IMOP life is too precious to be casual about it.
No, we don't; and, if you meant that as a reply to something I wrote, than I would like to point out that nothing I said implies that we would have to murder people to study NDEs unless you think that physician assisted suicide constitutes murder.
All that is required for what? It sounds like you're being dishonest here because in fact, an observational study would not provide experimental evidence. Observational studies like the one that you propose have strong biases. Consider, for the sake of example, that your study would have a sampling bias because it would exclude people who wouldn't come to a hospital. Your study might not be robust across cultures. There's plenty more not worth listing.
Don't try to put words in my mouth. Ask `whether' before `why.' I take it that you think physician-assisted suicide is murder--and I disagree, though if you want to have a discussion about it then you need to say so or state your claims--but you will notice that I never said that it is not possible to do the research without assisted suicide. This is why bull-headed skimming gets you nowhere. It is not possible to do carefully sampled experiments on NDEs without assisted suicides because a sampled experiment examining the phenomenon of NDEs entails inducing NDEs; in general, a sampled experiment examining any phenomenon entails inducing that phenomenon. It remains experimentally improper to make any ontological conclusions based on the available data on NDEs, or based on any observational studies on NDEs.
. . .
Good for you. So don't be casual about it. Read others' posts carefully.
Then actually assist humanity and be a volunteer.
What?
"this NDE seems hard to explain. "
Then no it is not evidence for anything, as by definition it has no explanation, and you have been told this enough times now for you to be able to recognise an argument from ignorance fallacy. I am also highly dubious about all of that story, it sounds far too contrived, and theists have too long a track record of lying about such claims. However and to absolutely clear, if every single word were true it would still be an argument for ignorance fallacy as you stated right at the start it is something you can't explain, then you went on to "explain" it with magic and a deity.
People claiming to have dreamed stuff while their brain was dying through oxygen starvation is not an objective way to validate anything.
@Sheldon and everyone, I hear lots of pro NDE researchers say that NDEs cannot be explained away by oxygen deprevation bc people have them in situations where no oxygen is lost. Therefore, if it were scientifically proven NDEs could not be explained by lack of oxygen, or even DMT in the brain, would you believe they are real? Remember, people say they feel like real life on steroids or much more real and lucid than real life
"Therefore, if it were scientifically proven NDEs could not be explained by lack of oxygen,"
You'd just be left with something you couldn't explain, again.
" Therefore, if it were scientifically proven NDEs could not be explained by lack of oxygen, or even DMT in the brain, would you believe they are real?"
Real what? Real unexplained things, yeah I'm fine with you and them claiming something happened they and you have no explanation for. I only object when you and they lie and pretend not having an explanation implies whatever you want to believe is somehow validated by being ignorant of what happened.
A more accurate way to put this is that in science, another explanation would only be a hypothesis, regardless of what the hypothesis would imply if it were true.
Russian Tank is always desperate to get the answer he wants, and in the past he has shown he is unable to temper his enthusiasm with any kind of critical or objective thinking. I'm afraid his past threads have shown he is unable to approach this topic with an open mind.
I stand by my comment as true regardless.
I didn't disagree with your comment at all. It's just wasted on RT.
@Russian-Tank
Whether or not there was a deprivation of oxygen, the very definition of an NDE is that the subject was close to death, caused by some physiological condition. Before we get to the actual content of the "dream" or "vision", we have to take the subject's condition into consideration.
Their condition is an abnormal state, their body is shutting down because of some deepening medical condition, or else they have suffered a trauma. Whether a lack of oxygen, an excess of adrenaline, severe physical trauma, foreign and deadly drugs, there are many causes. But no matter the cause, they are f--ked up.
NDE's can be explained by one of three categories. Psychological, physiological, and transcendental. The first two offer valid and logical explanations. So why do we need to delve into the third, a discipline that is not truly recognized or respected by serious researchers? IMO we are inventing this third explanation, in an attempt to dovetail it into religious beliefs.
Russian-Tank, you are obsessed by NDE's, because they fit neatly into your religious beliefs. But even if you removed the transcendental aspect, a valid explanation is there, and it does negate or dilute your beliefs.
I experienced an NDE myself, and I can explain everything that happened, from the causes to the final recovery. And nowhere in that two week journey do I need to invent anything transcendental. I am a very inquisitive person, yet I see no gaps in my adventure, there is nothing left for me to explore. I have all the answers, and I did not need to invent anything transcendental.
@Russian-Tank …..
Dr Maurice Rawlings was a serial NDE Author.... but he has a reputation for concentrating only on visions of hell..... so much so that even among those who believe in this nonsense his reputation is somewhat suspect...….
" Essentially, that is the backstory of why Maurice Rawlings reported so many hellish experiences: He wanted to get people’s attention in order to save them from the hell he believed in; he wanted to give them a chance to accept a faith he trusted completely, and telling heavenly NDE accounts was not going to achieve that. He was being steadfastly and thoroughly evangelical.
Despite his faith, a great many people object strenuously to that point of view and discount his work because of it. The real problem underlying the Rawlings material, however, is not theological. The problem is, as his fellow cardiologist (and fellow evangelical Christian) Michael Sabom pointed out repeatedly, a distortion of data."
http://dancingpastthedark.com/why-maurice-rawlings-report-many-hellish-n...
"[Rawlings] establishes himself before his audience as a cardiologist with impeccable credentials, a near-death researcher, and a committed Christian. Using these medical, scientific, and religious qualifications, he then presents the NDE as a glimpse of an afterlife and directly applies the Christian doctrine of heaven and hell to these experiences.
This gridlike approach, however, poses problems to Rawlings in his interpretation of his and others’ research when the type of person (for example, non-Christian) or type of near-death event (for example, suicide attempt) does not jibe with the expected afterlife destination (for example, hell).
Rawlings confronts the data of others with authoritative statements substantiated with little or no data of his own and illustrated with anecdotal accounts that, over time, appear to have been altered to fit his own designs…”
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