Geckos evolve rapidly in Brazil after new dam constructed

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Alembé's picture
Geckos evolve rapidly in Brazil after new dam constructed

A wonderful example illustrating how rapidly evolution can occur when changes in the environment caused existential selection pressures on populations of geckos and the changes that ensued.

http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/07/geckos-evolve-rapidly-brazil-afte...

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ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
There's something strangely

There's something strangely Lamarckian about all this. Except that instead of giraffes growing bigger necks to reach the treetops, its geckos growing bigger heads to eat bigger termites lol.

chimp3's picture
Nothing Lamarckian about this

Nothing Lamarckian about this. The article did not state that a single geckos head grew larger as an adaptation to larger termites and then passed that adaptation onto its offspring. The mechanism would have been selection for larger heads. Those with larger heads outcompeting those smaller. The genes for larger heads then spread through the gene pool.

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
I don't know, the article

I don't know, the article leaves out a lot of information, and I'm too lazy to read the journal entry.
What happened to the food they were originally eating? It just said there was bigger bugs available cause the bigger geckos died. Like it makes it sound like these geckos just got greedy and wanted that caviar meal with gold flakes lol.

The reason I say it sounds Lamarckian is because this adaptation should have happened regardless of isolation. Whats keeping a mutation from making the heads of all geckos 4% bigger before the dam happened?

chimp3's picture
Nothing is keeping the heads

Nothing is keeping the heads at any size. The mutations are random.

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
I know, so the whole notion

I know, so the whole notion of the dams and the pockets of island is irrelevant. A 4% increase in head could have been observed anywhere, since its random. No dam need apply.

She looked there for Lamarckian reasons.

chimp3's picture
Error.

Error.

algebe's picture
A species of moth in England

A species of moth in England had speckled black and white wings for camouflage against a background of tree bark. After the industrial revolution, soot and grime turned the trees black, and the moth's coloring turned almost completely black. Presumably the ones that weren't black were seen by birds and got eaten, while the black ones survived longer and had more offspring. Now the pollution has mostly gone, and moths are reverting to their original coloring.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/earth/wildlife/5577724/Moth-turns-from-b...

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
Classic, but if I'm not

Classic, but if I'm not mistaken, this is an example of natural selection at work, not evolution. Black and white moths were present in the population from the outset, just that the majority was white and minority black, then the roles reversed.

At least that's how I remember my bio textbook explaining it. One doesn't evolve into the other. One is selected over the other.

algebe's picture
But there have to be non

But there have to be non-standard (black) moths in a population of speckled moths for selection to occur. That's the mutation. A few would be born every generation and disappear because of their poor adaptation, until people turned all the trees black. That's how I remember evolutionary theory, though admittedly it's a long time since I've been in school.

chimp3's picture
John: "Classic, but if I'm

John: "Classic, but if I'm not mistaken, this is an example of natural selection at work, not evolution. Black and white moths were present in the population from the outset, just that the majority was white and minority black, then the roles reversed.
At least that's how I remember my bio textbook explaining it. One doesn't evolve into the other. One is selected over the other."

Exactly! Evolution = Random mutation ..then...Natural selection.

Nyarlathotep's picture
chimp3 - Exactly! Evolution =

chimp3 - Exactly! Evolution = Random mutation ..then...Natural selection.

That is what is so sad; John accepts mutation, and natural selection; but says evolution is impossible. It would be like believing there is such a thing as icecream and rootbeer; but saying rootbeer floats are impossible!

algebe's picture
And with bugs it can happen

And with bugs it can happen quite quickly because of their short life spans.

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
I do understand how it works.

I do understand how it works. But evolution didn't occur during the span of these observations, if a mutation did happen and presumably it did, it probably happened thousands of years ago. But at that point, what's the purpose of showing me this? Its not better than going out and killing all the white polar bears, and leaving all the black bear alive. Its natural selection, not evolution.

chimp3's picture
Nature selected the geckos

Nature selected the geckos with larger heads. That's a major part of evolution.

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
Mutations cause evolution,

Mutations cause evolution, they're what change the species and "evolve" them. Natural selection kills the species, as is evidence by the death of the bigger geckos, who presumably also had bigger heads, and ate those termites just fine. NS does evolve anything.

Evolution clearly didn't have the termites in mind, since they could have easily grown 4% bigger as well. Seeing how termites reproduce faster than geckos, I don't see why not.

Nyarlathotep's picture
John 6IX Breezy - Evolution

John 6IX Breezy - Evolution clearly didn't have the termites in mind

Another cartoon version emerges.

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
I wouldn't know, I'm too busy

I wouldn't know, I'm too busy studying to watch cartoons. But I'll trust your experience.

xenoview's picture
Fascinating that they could

Fascinating that they could adapt in a short amount of time.

Sky Pilot's picture
Dinosaurs within 100 years!

Dinosaurs within 100 years!

curious's picture
According to this statement

According to this statement below the larger size food that was usually available to the larger lizards became available to those minions after the larger ones extincts. But the size of the mouth and the food create difficulty for the small mouth to take it. The question is what kind of food the little geckos ate while waiting for the mouth to grow larger? is the scientific paper presented mentioned the temporary eating method?

"The geckos had small heads—only 1 centimeter wide—and some of the termites were nearly the same size. Eating them presented a challenge, kind of like a house cat trying to put a squirrel in its mouth"

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
That's what I'm saying lol.

That's what I'm saying lol. It just sounds like they got greedy and tired of eating at Waffle House, so they upgraded so they could eat at a Michelin-starred restaurant.

Whales eat krill. There's no reason why their head had to grow so they can fit a bigger termite. Snakes head never grew to accommodate bigger food, why couldn't the geckos have evolved a snake-like jaw.

xenoview's picture
John

John
Why do whales have big mouths? The geckos evolved bigger heads to eat bigger prey.

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
Right, then shouldn't baleen

Right, then shouldn't baleen whales evolve smaller heads, to eat the smaller prey?

CyberLN's picture
Funny.

Funny.

chimp3's picture
Simple. Baleen whale fossil

Simple. Baleen whale fossil shows origination of baleen. Large whales that eat small prey have to eat a lot of little things so big mouths help.

https://www.nature.com/articles/n-12286588

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
Just make smaller whales with

Just make smaller whales with smaller bodies and you don't have to eat so many.

The moment you try to rationalize things is when it sounds Lamarckian.

Just say these are the luckiest geckos and whales on the planet. And perhaps the luckiest researcher in the universe to have predicted randomness itself.

chimp3's picture
John : "Just make smaller

John : "Just make smaller whales with smaller bodies and you don't have to eat so many."

Who makes whales?

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
As it pertains to the

As it pertains to the conversation, evolution makes whales, not that difficult to follow.

chimp3's picture
There are large whales and

There are large whales and smaller whale species. They share a common ancestor. They have evolved to eat a variety of food.

ʝօɦռ 6IX ɮʀɛɛʐʏ's picture
No they didn't evolve to eat

No they didn't evolve to eat a variety of foods. They just evolved. Whether they find food or not is their problem. Stahp it with the lamarckian exclamations.

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