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Bringing you atheist articles and building active godless communities takes hundreds of hours and resources each month. If you find any joy or stimulation at Atheist Republic, please consider becoming a Supporting Member with a recurring monthly donation of your choosing, between a cup of tea and a good dinner.
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Bringing you atheist articles and building active godless communities takes hundreds of hours and resources each month. If you find any joy or stimulation at Atheist Republic, please consider becoming a Supporting Member with a recurring monthly donation of your choosing, between a cup of tea and a good dinner.
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@Rosedjan Re: "Even if they misinterpreted what happened, there are still too many claims of the supernatural for me to lump them all together under one category and scoff at them as a whole."
Consider this for a moment...
Why is it something is labeled "supernatural" just because an individual (or group) observing it cannot explain it? For instance, let us make an imaginary journey into the past. Saaaay... Oh, maybe just as little as 150 years. That would place us around the year 1869. (Incidently, that is only four years after the Civil War ended, and almost ten years before the first telephone was invented.) And let's say we are allowed to take a piece of our modern technology with us on this trip to 1869. For the purpose of this scenario, we will use a rather mundane item that we simply take for granted in our modern era today. Also, it should be something that can still function fully during that earlier time period. Hmmm.... Let's seee.... Oh, I know. Let's take a simple pair of night-vision/thermal imaging goggles with us. With me so far?...
Okay, so it is 1869 and we arrive with our modern-day goggles and demonstrate them to the general public in a very "mystical" manner. Sounds fairly straightforward, right? But, in reality, how well will our little device truly be received? My guess is, depending on which part of the world we are in, it is likely we will either be praised as gods or burnt as witches. Because the average person of that time period did not have the capacity to understand how it works, and therefore it would be deemed "supernatural". But WE know today there is absoluty nothing of the sort involved in the goggles. To us, it is simply basic technology we take for granted.
Now, back to our "modern" world of today where you state, "Even if they misinterpreted what happened, there are still too many claims of..." Yes, there are still many "claims" of supernatural made today, even though they have decreased considerably over the decades along with more and more scientific advances. But has it escaped your attention that a very large portion of the world's population is still greatly lacking in a proper education? Meaning there is still a considerably large number of people out there who do not have the capacity to comprehend/explain everything they encounter. Hence, "It's a (supernatural) MIRACLE!!!" Anyway, just a little food for thought.
I am actually not a proponent of automatically dismissing supernatural claims no matter what religion that belong to. I mean, sure I'm gonna be skeptical, but I think it's very possible for other religions to experience supernatural events. However, I probably won't agree with the way they interpret those events. For example, Islam claims that an angel inspired Muhammed to write the Koran. I think it's very possible that he definitely saw and experienced something, but that doesn't mean it was good. Christianity believes that Satan lies and deceives. My personal theory is that Muhammed could have been under the influence of an evil supernatural power. Especially after reading the testimonies of some of his followers.
And jesus died for our sins. Oh wait, he isn't dead but enjoying pina coladas in heaven?
So out of the 4 Christian accounts of the birth of Jesus. Which 3 were influenced by Satan. They can not all be true. (I included the Gospel of Mary.)
rosedjan - "Even if they misinterpreted what happened, there are still too many claims of the supernatural for me to lump them all together under one category and scoff at them as a whole."
I don't think you've tried hard enough, give it a shot. Once you use an unbiased open mind it will unravel pretty quickly, best to have a safety net for when Kansas goes bye bye.
When Kansas goes bye bye...LOL. I'm trying to figure out who Toto is in your analogy...William Lain Craig? Nope, he would be the Scarecrow...
"Supernatural" always translates {we don't know)
Even though I think the discussion in this thread so far has generally been respectful, I feel the nature of the discussion (i.e. a matter of heaven and hell, truth, faith etc.) is such that the debaters can seem somewhat cold and intimidating: @rosedjan I hope you don't take that too personally.
@Sapporo
Oh, I don't take it personally at all! This whole discussion has actually been pretty enlightening to me. Probably not in the way that most of you would *want* me to be enlightened (Lol), but enlightening all the same.
It's nice to know that people can still have civil conversations without resorting to personal attacks. So far, I haven't felt that way at all! You guys have been greats sports about this!
And I'm sure it's probably not something any of you want to hear, but I love you guys and y'all are totally in my prayers! (Don't worry.
I'm already anticipating flack for that statement, so do your worst! Lol XD)
The chronology of the posts indicate that ...
1) you made a claim about miracles.
2) that claim was challenged by asking for just one example.
3) you are running out the door.
rosedjan, is this how you, a self professed representative of christianity leaves an impression?
And yes, keep your prayers for those who are gullible. Saying you will pray for me is exceptionally rude and insulting. Very, very rude, condescending and arrogant.
In fact, this raises my ire to a level I rarely reach. You DARE to come in here, an atheist forum, and say you will pray for us? May your children be born with the sign of the devil.
David Killens,
"In fact, this raises my ire to a level I rarely reach. You DARE to come in here, an atheist forum, and say you will pray for us? May your children be born with the sign of the devil."
While rosedjan might have said that she would pray for us she didn't technically say that she would pray wonderful thoughts for us. She could have meant saying a prayer like you did = "May your children be born with the sign of the devil."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Imprecatory_Psalms
https://www.crosswalk.com/faith/bible-study/10-things-you-should-know-ab...
Just because someone says that they will pray for you doesn't meant that they will pray for your happiness and well-being. They might be praying that your head will rot off.
@Dio Re: "They might be praying that your head will rot off."
Oh my!.... *wringing hands nervously*... That could certainly explain the two big rust spots that suddenly appeared behind my ears shortly after Rosedjan said she would pray for us... *starting to hyperventilate*....Oh no! My head is going to rust away! Somebody, please, help! Who knows some type of counter-prayer??? Hurry!...
Relax...10w 40 bath, for the infection, and light sanding with Rustoleum touch-up.
"I'm already anticipating flack for that statement, so do your worst! Lol XD)"
You don't have a dog named Toto, do you?...or live in Kansas?
https://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/31/health/31pray.html
I apologize if my statement insulted you guys, but I don't necessarily apologize for the statement itself. And in case you're wondering, yes I will be praying for your well-being. =) Praying for your enemy's head to rot off... Yeah that's not how it works. Lol. XD
It's totally okay if you accuse me of being a coward or dodging your questions. It's not the first time and it definitely won't be the last. But regardless of how you feel about me. Know that, I have absolutely no hate or animosity in my heart for your guys. =) Do your comments sting? I guess. Sort of. Idk I'm too tired to really notice. XD Are they true? Not really. As I said, I would be in here discussing things all the live long day if I could, but time is a crazy character. I probably should have only responded to those who wished to discuss what I initially wanted to talk about. That was my bad for starting a bunch of conversations I couldn't finish. I honestly wasn't expecting as much of a response! Lol
Y'all are great! =)
Please try to understand rosedjan, try to put yourself in the other person's shoes. It is called empathy and your jesus preached it a lot.
Imagine you are a Muslim and befriended a christian. One day you invited that christian over for an afternoon in the backyard, wife, kids, neighbors, all the family stuff. And that christian brought as their contribution to pot luck a nice big piece of ham.
Or if I visited you in church service, but wore demonic garb and flicked my tongue at all the ladies like Gene Simmons?
When one is a guest that is visiting, going against the standards of the host is always offensive.
@ David Killens
Well, I appreciate your thoughts on the subject. I don't necessarily agree that my comments were on the same level as the scenarios you described, but I hope you'll find it in your heart to forgive my "insensitivity" if that's what it came across as. Again, I was not deliberately trying to come off as condescending or disrespectful. =)
@rosedjan
"I don't necessarily agree that my comments were on the same level as the scenarios you described"
Then you are insensitive, disrespectful, and arrogant.
Why should I forgive you? You still maintain your position.
@David Killens,
Well technically, if you maintain your position, my prayers should be as harmless to you as a child writing letters to Santa Claus. I don't get angry at kids who still write letters to Santa Claus. Both scenarios you used, equated your beliefs with a religion... Just thought it was interesting. =)
But this beginning to turn into a discussion that has gotten way off topic from my original subject. So, whether you forgive me or not, I genuinely hope you have a great day! And I'll leave it at that. =)
@rosedjan
So technically, if I attend one of your church services in a demonic costume and do the Gene Simmons tongue thingy towards all the women, that should be harmless and not offend anyone.
You still don't get it you arrogant and insensitive little person. It is not about faith, it is about being empathic and respectful to the place you visit. Be proud of your faith, you wear it well just like the christians who committed genocide and allow children to be raped.
David Killens,
"So technically, if I attend one of your church services in a demonic costume and do the Gene Simmons tongue thingy towards all the women, that should be harmless and not offend anyone."
Technically not everyone is welcomed =http://www.bricktestament.com/the_law/racial%20tolerance/dt23_03a.html 5 pictures
3 John 1:7 (Voice) = "They have gone out to serve under the banner of the Name, and they do not accept gifts from those outside our faith community."
rosedjan,
"I apologize if my statement insulted you guys, but I don't necessarily apologize for the statement itself. And in case you're wondering, yes I will be praying for your well-being. =) Praying for your enemy's head to rot off... Yeah that's not how it works. Lol. XD"
I told you that we bite and eat babies and T-Rexes.
Here's some good biblical prayers for your enemies =
Isaiah 14:11 (CEV) = "Your pride and your music have ended here in the world of the dead. Worms are your blanket, maggots are your bed.”
Psalm 3:7 (ERV) = "Lord, get up! My God, come rescue me! If you hit my enemies on the cheek, you will break all their teeth."
Psalm 58:6 (CEV) = "My enemies are fierce as lions, Lord God! Shatter their teeth. Snatch out their fangs."
Psalm 35:15-17 (ERV) = "15 But when I had troubles, they laughed at me.
They were not really friends.
I was surrounded and attacked
by people I didn’t even know.
16 They made fun of me, using the worst language.
They ground their teeth to show their anger.
17 My Lord, how long will you watch this happen?
Save my life from these people
who are attacking me like lions and trying to destroy me."
As the Jesus character said in Matthew 21:22 (ERV) = "If you believe, you will get anything you ask for in prayer.”
You do believe, don't you?
Prayers: Hopefully you are aware of the PEW Research studies. Prayer woorks about as well as Chance. When God begins healing amputees, we will all consider the utility of prayer.
"https://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/31/health/31pray.html
@Rosedjan Re: "...but I love you guys and y'all are totally in my prayers!"
Awwww.... How very sweet.... *blushing*... In return, I'll sacrifice a baby kitten for you during my next Blood Moon ritual. Sound fair?
Oh, dang-it! I just realized I have not yet addressed the OP topic yet. Crap! My bad. How rude of me. Uh, so, it was "Basic Message of the Bible", huh? Okay, here's my view...
...*holding phone to ear*.... *twerrrrl-twerrrrl..... twerrrrl-twerrrrl..... twerrrrrrl-twerrrrrrl...*... (fifty-seven minutes later)... *twerrrrl-twerrrrrl... twerrrrl-twerrrrl....twerllll-click-click*... "Hello, and thank you for calling God's Holy Prayer Hotline. If this is an emergency prayer, please hang up and dial 9-1-1. We're sorry, but God is very busy right now assisting billions of other Christians of various other sects. However, your prayers are always important to Him. Please stay on the line, and God will be with you as quickly as possible. Or, please feel free to leave your prayer on our automated messaging service, and God will answer your prayer in His own good time as His wisdom sees fit. To avoid potential confusion, be sure to include your name, date of birth, and address in your prayer message. To leave your prayer on the messaging service, press "1" at any time. Otherwise, please stay on the line, and God will be with you shortly.".... *sound of "Knocking On Heaven's Door" playing for on-hold music*.....
@Tin-Man, RE: Kitten Sacrafice
Not again! The last time you tried to sacrifice a kitten it fought back and you ended up in the hospital for a week. That's why we bought you the turtle, Just remember turtles are for burning and not for stabbing. We don't want you to hurt yourself. And use the BBQ in the back yard. We don't want you burning down the house. Finally, if the Jews next door are still waving chickens over their heads and then slicing the chicken's throats, do not look over the wall and tell them they are doing it wrong. You leave them to their sacrifice and they will leave you to yours.
@Cog Re: "The last time you tried to sacrifice a kitten it fought back and you ended up in the hospital for a week."
Oh, sure! Bring THAT up again!... *throwing hands up in exasperation*... Look, like I have told you many times already, the little bastard caught me totally off guard. How was I suppose to know kitten claws and teeth were so damn sharp? They're so friggin' cute and cuddly looking. And they are QUICK! He was up my pants leg before I realized it, and then-.... *shudder*... *beads of sweat forming on forehead*... Uh, I would rather not talk about this anymore for now. Ummm, I think I need a drink.... *quickly walking toward the bar*...
LOL Tin-Man, that is THE funniest kitty sacrifice story ever...I remember it like it was yesterday...lol...I had Satan rolling on the grass laughing his forked tail off at the atheist BBQ last weekend...he peed himself when I got to the part about the kitty running away with your special porpoise...LOL. Classic. BTW, thanks for the BBQ tip. Dead baby definitely stays tender on open flame, when marinated overnight...Mmmmm, deeee lish! I saved you a foot to try. You missed a great party...you should have come...the big man was asking about you. Everyone was there, joel osteen and tammy fay did a wonderful dance number to great applause. Tammy cried, big surprise. Pol pot got wasted and passed out in the hot tub, check out his FB page, that lush...hilarious, and stalin sang frank sinatra's, "I did it my way". Dude you missed the back yard bbq of the year.
Welcome Hannah,
I was a devout Catholic for over 40yrs. I now identify as athiest.
After working in Pediatric Oncology I started to question my faith. How can an all knowing super entity allow such suffering amongst these beautiful children? All because Serpent Satan hoodwinked Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden? When was the last time I saw God grow limbs on an amputee? As a result these questions, I started studying Ivy League Biblical Scholars.
The bible is forged. Matthew, Mark Luke and John did Not write any of the gospels. There are Zero first hand accounts of Jesus. Less than 2% of the population could read or write during that time period. Evil is real, the devil is Not. 666 stands for Caesar Nero, not Satan!
Stanford University did a research project on the effectiveness of intercessory prayer. Conclusion: Prayer is a powerful placebo. It taps into the same neurological pathways as meditation. Providing a peaceful feeling.
@RF -666 - Satan Does not even appear in the bible until the Christians get hold of the myth., In the OT, he is God's good right hand man who only does what he is told to do by God.
Heaven, Hell, Satan - All of it is Christian mythology.
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