Have any Christian friends that just don't seem to think rationally? Send them this video link bit.ly/TheMostHatedOfJesusTeaching and you will never hear from them again....
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@ Chuck Graham
"Have any Christian friends that just don't seem to think rationally? Send them this video link"
Why on earth would I want to do that?
From whence did you gain the quaint notions that (1) religious belief has anything to do with rational thinking? For most people religion is simply an accident of birth.The beliefs are absorbed, uncritically before the age of reason and are exceedingly difficult to change . Perhaps one reason we atheists are in the minority?
(2) That you or we are more rational simply because we are atheists. I have never seen any strong evidence to support such a claim .
There is a certain smug condescension from many atheists who seem to believe religious believers are 'less than' ; less intelligent, less educated, less rational, less sane . That may be demonstrably true of the atypical apologists we get here. However, I have yet to see credible evidence which allows me to accept such claims as general principles covering ,what 6 BILLION believers?
To point one, I agree almost entirely. In fact, otherwise incredibly intelligent individuals at least seem to work very hard to actually suspend the application of rational thinking when it comes to their religion. It's as if highly intelligent people, who are rational and skeptical about a number of other subjects, consciously, or maybe unconsciously, reject critical thinking when it comes to their faith. I think these people often rectify this by claiming that faith has nothing to do with rational thinking, and that god doesn't want one to think logically, but rather to believe... as if religion and scientific thinking operate under completely different realms of reality. The problem comes up when, of course, religions or the religious begin to make scientific claims, often without realizing it, and yet continue to claim that they don't need to justify such things with logic or evidence. So there are some problems there. But I agree, rational thinking doesn't necessarily have anything to do with religion.
As far as point two... according to numerous studies, atheists do tend to be more intelligent and better educated. As to whether or not we're "more rational..." well that's a pretty vague claim to make, so I'm not really sure. I would argue that we're wholly more rational when it comes, specifically, to the claims of religion. Otherwise, we wouldn't be atheists.
What do you think, cranky?
grs2020
"As far as point two... according to numerous studies, atheists do tend to be more intelligent and better educated."
Before I go any further I need to say that this is not a matter I care about one way or t'other. Not convinced it's possible to prove either way. Not something I think about unless confronted with some of the truly idiotic believers we get here. However, it is my observation that people who belong to internet forums tend to be atypical, and not a reflection of the general community.
I repeat; religious belief has nothing to do with intelligence. Nor do I believe that atheism is necessarily based on rational thought. I might be wrong. Haven't seen any studies.
It's often said that cynics are disappointed romantics. A crude generalisation, but one with some truth I think. Similarly, I think that a 'goodly number' of atheists are disappointed believers. Believers often say to atheists " Oh, you're just angry with god". I suspect that is is true for at least some atheists. Impossible to tell whether the reason an atheist gives for his loss of belief is true or simply a rationalisation, after the fact.
I guess the point I'm trying to make is that we atheists are just ordinary people. So far, I've seen no credible evidence which proves we form some kind of elite within society. (excluding members of this forum of course)
@cranky47 it requires a certain amount of insanity to believe you are a Christian and not obey anything that Jesus taught even if it is 6 billion people who are claiming to be Christians. For example, how many Christians do you know that they think it's a sin to work for money? Jesus said it's a sin to work for money in Matthew 6:24 It's also a sin to work for food in John 6:27 If you say you are a Christian and disobey what Jesus taught then you aren't really a Christian. The problem is that religion teaches people to lie to themselves which if you do it enough you will go completely insane. The Bible calls insanity a seared conscience. People go against their conscience and end up losing it completely. Biggest piece of advice to give to the 6 billion Christians is to get them to admit that they aren't Christians.
When I was a JW I had the “truth”. I was very rational and knew my religion well. I felt for everyone outside my religion who were caught up in Satan’s world and tried my best to educate them on what a wonderful future they could have.
There are so many elements to religious belief. I was raised a witness. Social interaction and family were witnesses...etc. I believed in Jehovah whole-heartedly.
There is no easy way to turn anybody to anything. My mom who is still a JW is 72 and still believes (her whole life) that Armageddon is coming even though she’s personally witnessed at least two unfulfilled expectations of “the end”.
Charles here. The video link I sent, did anyone watch the YouTube video thoroughly from start to finish?
...nope...guilty....just read the headline
Lol. Probably should watch the video first bit.ly/TheMostHatedOfJesusTeaching it's a pretty good video y'all will enjoy it.
...you fucking kidding me... that video was as much torture as researching JW literature ...
If you think that video would change anything or anyone you are sadly mistaken...btw is it really pointing us to what God wants at the end? Why don’t you explain, in your own words, instead of pointing us to a video...I’d like to hear your thoughts.
From what I understand one can only become a Believer/Christian/Disciple/Born Again if they start OBEYING Jesus' commands (FYI parables aren't commands or teachings most people get them confused with what Jesus taught. The same goes for Torah law like not eating pork, don't get Torah commands confused with Jesus' teachings)
The following are just a few of Jesus' commands.
Before you start calling yourself a Christian or even thinking that you're a Christian you have to forsake everything you have, houses, car, wealth and property.
Luke 14:33
Sell all those things and give the money away.
Luke 12:33
Life isn't about gaining material possessions but about loving God and others. Spend your life serving God not money and the things it can buy.
Matthew 6:19-20 & Matthew 6:24
Do this and God will look after making sure you are fed and clothed.
Matthew 6:33
But not obeying these things makes you an unbeliever. You remain under God's wrath.
1 peter 2:4-6
Think it is enough to believe that Jesus is real and call him Lord, Lord? Think again. Even the devils believe and it doesn't do them any good.
James 2:18-19
Only those who obey what Jesus taught really love Him.
"Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.” - John 15:21
There are no Churches in the world that are teaching people this because organized religion needs people to work their 9-5 jobs to tithe to the church, not forsake your jobs and everything you own to become poor. People love money to much to actually take Jesus's teachings literal. Most likely everyone on this forum who claims to have been a follower of Christianity at some point were never really Christians to begin with.
I was...I worked part time to support myself very poorly and spent 90hours a month going door to door, just like the bible says. Putting in my old JW hat -
Abraham was blessed by god...rich
Moses blessed by God...rich
David, Joseph, Esther, Job rich, rich, rich...
But Whitefire, that’s the old testament - true, but God stays the same so now to the new...
Apostles worked regular jobs except our
favorite tax collector (who would have made a few extra bucks in the side). Paul had been a Pharisee so rich. They gave up their regular jobs to do what Jesus had told them to do...preach.
Oops - we’re in a pickle. Jesus clears his throat. Rich people need to give it up for the poor (cause they ain’t working no more)
End of story. End of my ‘splaining. That video asserts much - as do all religions. That’s why we have soooo many. I do not argue over old texts written after the “assumed fact” - translated, interpreted, twisted, explained, shit.
I will debate the existence of aliens... much more plausible discussion.
Oh, and I refused to convince anybody of anything. That’s why I’m here cause I can joyfully throw out my thoughts to a group of like minds (?!?!? Well...uh....maybe some). If someone in my real life asks, I answer. The key being asks... and I don’t attack (you’re wrong watch this video) but I’ll ask them a lot of questions.
@Whitefire13
So... what is your thoughts on aliens?
:)
My spirit guide says they’re real. Ashtray, I mean Ashtar command will be here soon to save us.
But in all seriousness ... a different thread may be warranted.
I think “life” has found its way into every crook and nanny here in earth... I would not be surprised if and when science finds life within our solar system or outside of it - when and if we “get” there. I think we will. I grew up on Star Trek...loved that shit.
If prayer actually worked, we would be able to pray the faith away from the religious. Alas! Prayer, like so many other religious ideas is just a waste of time and effort. I might as well talk to the wall.