Why is God NOT real?

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AnonMtz20's picture
Why is God NOT real?

God is real to me. Others believe He isn't. I am wondering, though, why isn't He? Because you don't see Him? I am really curious.

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Nyarlathotep's picture
I can't speak for everyone of

I can't speak for everyone of course (atheism is a pretty broad tent!).

I do not have a belief in any of the following deities:
Osiris
Zeus
Ganesh
Yahweh
Odin
Suijin
Yakcha
Krishna
and many many more.

If you can give me an objective reason I should take one (or more) of these more seriously than the others, I would be interested in hearing it.

AnonMtz20's picture
I've not ever heard of those

I've not ever heard of those until now. Heh. I'm sure people do believe in them stongly. But, really, all I ask is : Why do you not believe or take them seriously?

Nyarlathotep's picture
It seems unrealistic that

It seems unrealistic that they could all be real, therefore we must discard some of them. But since I don't have a way to differentiate between them, there is no reason to throw out some and keep others. So I will start by throwing them all out. If you have any reason I should make an exception for a certain one, let me know.

Also FYI: Yahweh is the god of the bible :)

Ellie Harris's picture
Why so you have faith in an

Why so you have faith in an undemonstrated claim (god)?

mysticrose's picture
There are lot of deities in

There are lot of deities in the history of religion but none of them have remarkable evidences of existence. As time goes on, they only proven to be part of myth, hoax and legends.

Lmale's picture
Sorry i hate correcting you

Sorry i hate correcting you because your nice. But the 'mythical gods' were never actually disproved other 'peace and love' religions killed or forced their followers to convert and because people dont tend to join a religion (a few do there are exceprions to most rules) and brainwashing in the old religion was replaced with brainwashing in the new within a few generations the descendents of the survivors didnt even know their ancestors were forced to believe end of religion but the religions are still equally possible.

Олександр Грінченко's picture
The question in wrong and

The question in wrong and simply stupid. Why should I believe and take seriously something that does not exist. Do you believe in elves or in gnomes? I bet you don't . So, why don't you take gnomes seriously? I don't take god seriously because he (or it) does not exist.

Capt.Bobfm's picture
Please enlighten us and tell

Please enlighten us and tell us why you believe.

maryam's picture
I think I can answer it..!!!

I think I can answer it..!!!

If superiority in the universe is defined by servanthood and mastership, then by looking at the kingdom of God, man will find that he is the master of every thing else in the universe. All genera serve him: the genus right beneath him, which is the animals, and the genus beneath the animals, which is the plants, and what is beneath the plants, which is the inanimate beings. Those genera are classified with great wisdom, such that the inferior genus would serve all genera superior to it.

For example, the inanimate beings that we see around us, such as the sun, the moon, the mountains, the elements of the earth and the water, they all serve the genera above them. They serve the plants and provide it with food and all the elements required for its growth. They also serve animals providing it with the essential elements for its survival and continuance. The inanimate beings also serve man, providing him with all the necessary elements of life.
If we ascend one level to the plants, we do not find it serving its inferior genus, which is the inanimate beings, but serving the superior genera to it which are the animals and the human beings. If we ascend one more time to the animals, we still will not find it serving its inferiors, but again serving its superior genus, which is the human being. Then the circle of servanthood stops, and we do not find any other genera that man would serve. So the servanthood in the whole universe has stopped at the level of man and now man should look for his mission in this world.

The inanimate beings have a mission to do in serving the plants, animals and human beings, and the plants have a mission to do in serving the animals and the humans. Also the animals have a mission to do for the humans. And then servanthood stops. So man, what is your mission as a human being? And who are you serving in this world? You have been deceived by your innovation of a lot of the secrets of the universe. And as a rational being with the ability to reason you ought to have understood your mission first, before you try to figure out the mission of others serving you.

This is the first task for the mind: man has to look for his mission in life. If he does not search for it, then he must consider himself lower than the inanimate beings, less significant than the plants, and more trivial than the animals. But how would the master be less important than the servant? Therefore, man as a master ought to have a mission appropriate to his mastership over the rest of the genera.

This is one stance that man ought to stand. There is yet another stance: You as a human being served by all other genera, when did those genera serve you?

Did they serve you after you possessed a mind, and after you have used that mind to control them and make them serve you?
Or did those genera serve you before you obtained your mind and before you had the ability to reason?

Did they serve you because they are under your control following your commands?

Did you command the sun to shine, the moon to rise, the air to move and the sky to rain? Definitely, you did not have power over any of this!
You were not supposed to accept your existence in life in such a passive attitude, where you only benefit from others. Your duty is to look for your own mission in this world so that you would not be less significant than those beneath you.

Everything else serves you, and who do you serve? You ought to examine that and give it some thought. Suppose that you were alone at home with no one else around you and then you woke up and found a table with a variety of food set for your breakfast. Is it not common sense to use your own mind and try to find out who set up the table for you?

In this world, you are just like that person who found things at his service, without having power over them and without even knowing about them. It is your duty as a human being to search for whoever created those things and made them subservient to you, without you having any power over them and even before you got your own mind. Allah bestows mercy on people to lead them out of their negligence by sending them messengers to solve those mysteries: Who provided you with those things that you have no power over them? And who has made them subservient to you before even you can have any power to control them? The messengers came to solve this mystery for us. So when God sent His messenger, you ought to have listened carefully to them so that you can get the puzzle sorted out. By that you would regain your value in this world, instead of being a negligible person without a function or a determined mission. You should have listened to the messenger and obeyed him better than deafening your ears and turning away from him. This is another absolute foolishness.

The first irrational act from you is ignoring your mission. And the second one is that you turned away from those who came to solve the mystery for you. However, Allah is merciful and He continued to send his messengers to remind us because he is the All Merciful God. He knows the negligence of the human being. He sent the messengers so that no one could claim that he did not know. But did Allah (SWT) send the messengers to establish those matters of servanthood and mastership? Of course not, those rules have always been there, He (SWT) sent the messengers to remind the people. So normally the concept of mans mission in life should be well known, and at a point in time man forgets his role and then Allah (SWT) would send His messenger as a mere reminder to the people

gerstelbrau's picture
Maryam: You said:

Maryam: You said:

"If superiority in the universe is defined by servanthood and mastership..."

Only religious nutcases and narcissists define superiority that way. The rest of us define "superior" as "better," not "ability to kill the inferior thing at will".

"..., then by looking at the kingdom of God, man will find that he is the master of every thing else in the universe. All genera serve him: the genus right beneath him, which is the animals, and the genus beneath the animals, which is the plants, and what is beneath the plants, which is the inanimate beings. Those genera are classified with great wisdom, such that the inferior genus would serve all genera superior to it."

That's absurd, unless you subscribe to theory above. I'm not superior to bacteria or rocks. I'm a different thing. Besides, there's are lots of things bacteria and rocks and iguanas can do that I can't. Doesn't that make them superior to me?

"For example, the inanimate beings that we see around us, such as the sun, the moon, the mountains, the elements of the earth and the water, they all serve the genera above them."

Huh? The moon serves the sun? What does the sun serve? What's the highest "being" in your orthodoxy next to Allah? (Just curious.)

"They serve the plants and provide it with food and all the elements required for its growth. They also serve animals providing it with the essential elements for its survival and continuance. The inanimate beings also serve man, providing him with all the necessary elements of life."

So, the soil contains nutrients that plants need because it wants to? And animals become food for humans out of choice? What are you smoking?

"If we ascend one level to the plants, we do not find it serving its inferior genus, which is the inanimate beings, but serving the superior genera to it which are the animals and the human beings. If we ascend one more time to the animals, we still will not find it serving its inferiors, but again serving its superior genus, which is the human being."

Hmmm. Are bees animals? Don't bees help plants by spreading pollen? Don't cows help plants by generating manure? Do people not help plants by, I don't know, growing them in their gardens for pleasure?

"Then the circle of servanthood stops, and we do not find any other genera that man would serve."

Bullhockey, as stated above.

"So the servanthood in the whole universe has stopped at the level of man and now man should look for his mission in this world."

Why does man need a mission? Because you say so?

"The inanimate beings have a mission to do in serving the plants, animals and human beings, and the plants have a mission to do in serving the animals and the humans. Also the animals have a mission to do for the humans."

Only in the fantastical imagination of theists. In the real world, this is nonsense.

"And then servanthood stops."

Thank Zeus!

"So man, what is your mission as a human being? And who are you serving in this world? You have been deceived by your innovation of a lot of the secrets of the universe. And as a rational being with the ability to reason you ought to have understood your mission first, before you try to figure out the mission of others serving you."

Again, says who?

"This is the first task for the mind: man has to look for his mission in life. If he does not search for it, then he must consider himself lower than the inanimate beings, less significant than the plants, and more trivial than the animals. But how would the master be less important than the servant? Therefore, man as a master ought to have a mission appropriate to his mastership over the rest of the genera."

It's true. Some people need to have a mission - a grand task or purpose that they use to define themselves. If they can't find one, they make up a fairy tale to give them one. We call those people "religionists."

"This is one stance that man ought to stand. There is yet another stance: You as a human being served by all other genera, when did those genera serve you?

"Did they serve you after you possessed a mind,..."
"Did they serve you because they are under your control following your commands?"

They don't serve me. I use them. And they use us. Just ask Mr. Ebola...

"Did you command the sun to shine, the moon to rise, the air to move and the sky to rain? Definitely, you did not have power over any of this!
You were not supposed to accept your existence in life in such a passive attitude, where you only benefit from others. Your duty is to look for your own mission in this world so that you would not be less significant than those beneath you."

No it's not. You made that up. Why should I care of my "significance" vis-a-vis the rosebush outside my door? We are both here. We both want to live. We both do what we can. I am neither better nor worse than it.

"Everything else serves you, and who do you serve? You ought to examine that and give it some thought. Suppose that you were alone at home with no one else around you and then you woke up and found a table with a variety of food set for your breakfast. Is it not common sense to use your own mind and try to find out who set up the table for you?"

Yes, it is. Some people, who could not (or were too lazy or stupid to) find evidence for it, would just make something up to explain it. We call those people...you guessed it..."religionists."

"In this world, you are just like that person who found things at his service, without having power over them and without even knowing about them. It is your duty as a human being to search for whoever created those things and made them subservient to you, without you having any power over them and even before you got your own mind."

That's what science is for. And so far, the evidence does not point to any "who."

"Allah bestows mercy on people to lead them out of their negligence by sending them messengers to solve those mysteries: Who provided you with those things that you have no power over them? And who has made them subservient to you before even you can have any power to control them? The messengers came to solve this mystery for us. So when God sent His messenger, you ought to have listened carefully to them so that you can get the puzzle sorted out. By that you would regain your value in this world, instead of being a negligible person without a function or a determined mission. You should have listened to the messenger and obeyed him better than deafening your ears and turning away from him. This is another absolute foolishness."

Absolut foolishness is believing a lie due to one's inability to accept "I don't know" for an answer. We call those people...never mind.

"The first irrational act from you is ignoring your mission."

The first irrational act is believing that you can't define that for yourself.

"And the second one is that you turned away from those who came to solve the mystery for you."

The second one is that you turned to the writings of a group of racist charlatans to solve the mystery for you.

"However, Allah is merciful and He continued to send his messengers to remind us because he is the All Merciful God. He knows the negligence of the human being."

Why was he stupid enough to make us that way? (Oh wait, I know. He looooves murdering us by the kazillions and then get us to praise him for it. It's almost like he had a bit with Lucifer.)

SS

Jeff Vella Leone's picture
Never ask the WHY question to

Never ask the WHY question to a theist !!!!!!!!!!!!

it is as if you said:

PLEASE PREACH

lol

Always make direct questions, yes or no if possible :P

Hope he doesn't read your post Capt :P

AnonMtz20's picture
He is a she. Hahah and I don

He is a she. Hahah and I don't have time to respond to that right now, but I won't preach about it. I have my beliefs anf you have yours... (:

Sloth's picture
I am a former Christian.

I am a former Christian. Raised in the religion all of my life. Despite things never making much sense to me, I was taught to never question it. At about age fifteen, I sincerely began to question things, against what I had been brainwashed to see as the ultimate and only truth. I learned that the bible is not such a perfect book, that there are countless contradictions from things as simple as Jesus's robe color, to greater things such as his last words before death. I think truly that a lot of the verses were even edited to appeal to the followers of the times. However, it is not just Christianity that I dismiss. I dismiss all religions that believe in a personal, subliminal, relationship with a god/gods. If the followers of each of these religions honestly in their hearts believed that God had spoken to them or directly influenced them, their god's were telling them VERY different things...
This was enough proof to me that there is no single god that directly speaks to people.

ChildofGod's picture
Like you said as a former

Like you said as a former Christian, ok see where you went wrong is when you decided to question God to point of non-existence. Theres than and then there's deciding that believing in God is a brainwashing thing. Us current Christians believe that God does things to help us, He won't always say yes, He says no a lot but only because the timing isn't right, you aren't ready, or because of greediness.

Nyarlathotep's picture
"Us current Christians

"Us current Christians believe that God does things to help us, He won't always say yes, He says no a lot but only because the timing isn't right, you aren't ready, or because of greediness."

Yes, so when things go your way: God did it! When things don't go your way: the timing was right (or whatever).

With that mindset you can justify the belief in anything.

ChildofGod's picture
there are no such thing as

there are no such thing as things going your way, it always goes the way God wants it to go. ok deaths of loved ones, always makes people question the existence of God because people tend to ask "why god? if you were even real why take the one person who mattered to me the most? they werent ready" well see i cant say i never done that before because i have but then i came to realize that when people die, who believe that God created them to live their life, they died because God needs them more than we do, everything happens for a reason, my grandfather died less than 2 years ago, he was my best friend, and in that time i question God and his existence. But then came to the realization that he believed in God so he was going to be with Him and the rest of his family who passed before him. God has our lives planned out for us. its a matter of belief and trust in the Lord. So when things go "our way" it actually goes the way God has planned, and when it doesnt its because thats not the right choice God has for us.

Zaphod's picture
So when you do pray do not

So when you do pray do not ever ask god for things since you know he, she or it going to do what ever the plan was anyways?

Do ever ask god for things besides guidance and strength to be a good person while enduring his plan?

ChildofGod's picture
no we ask God for the

no we ask God for the strength to get through the troubles in life, guidance so we can find the right path. We cannot see or hear God but we know Hes there to help us... In the Bible it says "Ask and you shall recieve, Look and you shall find, Knock and the door will be open to you" but doing that you should ask in the name of our Father, Jesus Christ. But like i said sometimes the answer is yes and other times the answer is no.

Zaphod's picture
There is a differnce between

There is a differnce between believing and knowing something.

Based on what you said above I would reason you would believe that praying for something from your god rather than from yourself would be sacriligious and praising god for his divine plan would be more appropriate even in face thing like the loss of or suffering of your father or an innocent child.

ex-christian_atheist's picture
"Where you went wrong is

"Where you went wrong is deciding to question God."
Do you not realize that considering something unquestionable because if you question it you wont believe it aymore means that it's probably not true? When people tell you not to question something, its usually because they know it isn't true and they don't want you to know that. If something is true, it will stand up to questioning and criticism. If it is false, well, questions and investigation usually reveal that.

vismitananda's picture
Man has already reached the

Man has already reached the moon and soon more interstellar space bodies will be reach, and they still believed in this imaginary person exist?

The only reason man created god is for "money/profit, personal drawings, and tyranny" no more no less. Because if he really is the savior, you won't look both way crossing the street, because you believed in him.

ChildofGod's picture
believe me when i say this, i

believe me when i say this, i dont look both ways when i cross, i know God is next to me holding my hand telling me when the right time to cross is. and as far as "this imaginary person" and them believing in Him, it's because He brought them to the moon and back safely. For all we know they could've died up there or they couldve ran out of gas or whatever while going there or coming back.

Zaphod's picture
If you don't look both ways

If you don't look both ways before you cross, are well on your way to learning the truth about what is in store for you after you die so I recommend you be damn sure what comes next before crossing the road.

this reminds me of a story of a man and a flood:

There was this flood and and rescue teams were sent out to retrieve people on their rooftops,

went they got to this rather religious fellow who was spotted praying to God,

He said "Go save someone else for my faith is strong I know God will keep me safe"..

well a little while later he was on his chimney and another boat came by,

once again he said "Go save someone else for my faith is strong I know God will keep me safe"..

A little while later the water had now reached his waist and a helicopter cam by and dropped him a rope,

but he waved them on saying once again "Go save someone else for my faith is strong I know God will keep me safe"..

finally the man now had water up to his chin and nothing left to stand on losing his strength,

he said to the heavens "God I don't understand, I have always been faithful and I really believed you would give me the strength to survive this."...

Then and there the sky opened up and voice came down from the heavens, it said:

"I already sent you two boats and a helicopter what the hell else can you expect of me."

ChildofGod's picture
Well wherever you heard that

Well wherever you heard that from, i would have to call crap on that story for i know that God would never say that. If you put someone else before you in life like saving wise God will honor that the most because not only did you risk your life to save someone elses but you also put your faith in God to help you. So i doubt that in that story, if it was real, God wouldnt say such words to a child of his

Zaphod's picture
It was a joke told by a

It was a joke told by a priest with a moral which I think you missed.

ChildofGod's picture
then please tell me what the

then please tell me what the moral was supposed to be

Zaphod's picture
God helps those who help

God helps those who help themselves.

You can't expect god to do everything for you If you believe he already gave you two eyes and the ability to look both ways before you cross the street would't it be an insult and waste of his gift not to watch where you were going.

Of course, you probably also believe in the gift of free will granted by God as well so would understand God gives you the choice as to whether or not throw away the gifts he's granted you by taking stupid risk. But if your a christian there is a parable that would much apply to this case and means that with such attitude you would not inherit the kingdom of God.

Of course we are not so much worried if you make it to the kingdom of god as you wise up and change your ways before getting yourself killed.

I wonder if you can't get an honorable mention in the Darwin awards, keep it up and you'll get a trophy.

CyberLN's picture
"believe me when i say this,

"believe me when i say this, i dont look both ways when i cross". Is one of the most profoundly selfish and egocentric things I've read in this forum in a very, very long time.

ChildofGod's picture
how is it selfish? because i

how is it selfish? because i put my faith in God to keep me safe?

CyberLN's picture
well, I think you are the one

well, I think you are the one responsible for your own safety in this situation. If you think you are not, and it's your gawd's responsibility to keep you safe then you haven't free will. If it is your responsibility to keep yourself safe, and not your gawd's, then by not looking when you cross the street you are spitting in your gawd's eye. So which is it CoG?
Additionally, when you get hit by a car, you or your gawd have now ventured into messing with someone else's life. Each at the expense of the other.

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