Yet another huge event in artificial intelligence.
The ai powered self driving cars had been tested for a year or more without drivers, on public roads.
They launched 2 days ago.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eq89YGbERzs
See also How Waymo Got To Ditch The Driver in California - YouTube
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Update:
A key error the responders here have made, is assuming the Waymo service hasn't launched, due to it's imperfection. [It actually had launched a few days ago.] They seem to completely ignore the high fatality rate of the non-self driving cars, forgetting also that regular cars are now still subject to study, since 1885, i.e. for over 130 years.
Some responders seem to expect a self-driving launch with the potential for zero fatalities, while ironically ignoring that regular car manufacturing, [being involved with high levels of fatalities each day], are still being studied as well, for 133 years.. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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As a new rule or rather suggestion, I urge responders to include sources/valid citations, as it is quite demonstrable by now that many feelings are intertwined in peoples' responses, devoid of many facts, especially when they avoid providing sources.
Please try to include sources/valid citations that seek to substantiate points, as often as possible.
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https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Trunk+monkey
Toyota introduced the Trunk Monkey in 2007. I would rather have a Trunk Monkey.
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Do you ever watch a video before jumping to conclusions. (50) Everyone stopped at a crosswalk and the Waymo car sailed right through. This is another prototype in a long line of prototypes. It is not being Launched. It is not safe for the roads yet. (55) "It does not have driving rules right."... "The Waymo breaks a lot, it breaks for no reason." "The Waymo turns on it's blinker and then aims at a parked car. It does not know how to drive. A human being would not aim at a parked car." (47:30)
I can't watch any more. Once again - YOU ARE WRONG!
You're joking right? Are we watching the same video above? The video in the OP is also only 1:18 minutes long. Which video are you watching? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Why do you think Waymo got a permit to ditch the driver in California?
At any cost see this article: "Waymo launches its first commercial self-driving car service"
Article introduction: "The rumor was true: Waymo's self-driving car service is here. The company has launched Waymo One, its first commercial ride hailing offering."
( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
@Avant Brown
I look forward to the day I can ditch my expensive car, and for far cheaper hail a self driving vehicle that arrives at my doorstep within 5 minutes and take me directly to wherever I want to go.
I really look forward to the day where I can hail a self driving "RV" that has a nice comfy bed, a place to plug in my laptop and maybe a small kitchenette where I can instead of catching planes to do my work, if my final destination is within 1000 miles, I could simply hail the self driving RV, at like 10pm, bring a small suitcase, browse the web for a bit, get 7-8 hours of sleep, wake up and make my self a little breakfast, get dressed etc all to arrive at the doorstep of my destination at 8am the next day.
I think at least at current pace of innovation these scenarios are likely to play out in the next 10 years. There will be gaps and problems during deployment, namely weather. There is a reason certain small areas of phoenix has been the testing grounds for waymo, it is sunny and rain/snow free nearly 365 days of the year.
The article you linked, says right away that there will be human drivers ready to take back control at a moments notice, for now, so this is not really self driving. More of a level 3 self driving out of the 1-5 autonomous rating. Good progress to be sure, but in every sense of the word, self driving has NOT yet arrived.
Self driving cars have a large hurdle to overcome, it must be far safer than human drivers due to how sensitive people are to disruptive technologies that changes something that most of them do every day. Thing is they are already safer than human drivers, as they do not get tired, distracted or drunk/high. But they are still far short of your competent, attentive driver that is not impaired in someway. Worse still they must operate in an environment of HUMAN drivers, those same, tired, possibly impaired drivers, or worse still they must deal with impatient, aggressive, speedsters that break the law constantly. How many of us come to a complete stop when making a right at an intersection of which there is a red light for those going strait through the intersection? My guess few to none, not a problem for human drivers, huge problem for a computer driver that has to follow rules exactly. The very act of making computer drivers safer sometimes makes them more dangerous.
I know of some highways near me where the posted speed limit for a section is 55, but especially during evening rush hour, if you are going any slower then 65, even in the slower right lane, you will be a road hazard. Everyone in the area knows it is far too dangerous for cops to pull people over there, so people regularly go 80-90 mph through there.
I guess what I am saying is: I like you am looking forward to all the incredible convenience and safety and money saving self driving represent, but I am well aware true, no drivers licence needed get to your destination at any time anywhere is still many years off sadly.
Worse still, our aging overloaded road/freeway system desperately needs everyone to go self driving cars right now and kick off all non self driving capable cars, but unfortunately we are likely decades from that, and every major large growing city is going to have increasingly gridlocked traffic jams, which results in increased amounts of accidents with some of those being fatal.
I think the following analogy closely resembles your logic:
[Oceans without whales that died off, are not actually oceans.]
Note that these cars have been tested on public roads, in everyday conditions, for more than a year now without people in driver's seat.
See How Waymo Got To Ditch The Driver in California - YouTube
The autonomous car 0-5 rating system is not of my own design but an increasingly accepted industry standard. I am well aware google (waymo) has been testing level 4 and 5 systems for sometime now, in very controlled conditions. I am just stating this particular "launch" cannot yet claim fully autonomous until they do transition away from truly driverless, even if the cars are capable of it.
And I in particular am waiting for the day where I can use my uber/lyft phone app and get to my destination, no human with a drivers licence needed at all. In my hometown, not a small section of phoenix.
This is a start, a good milestone, but I cannot sell my current car yet, not even close, we are still many years away from that.
I didn't say the autonomous range was of your doing. I simply pointed out that while the waymo machine may reasonably be called a class 4 autonomous vehicle, it was launched as such, but with agents on standby, despite the vehicles being tested without agents in driver's seat. This way, it is reasonably launched to appear like a class 3 system as you somewhat correctly underlined, although it has demonstrable class 4 capabilities.
And I agree, class 5 taxi service self driving cars will probably not happen for 5 or more years.
And actually, since the damn thing turns on a turn signal then turned into a parked car, I think it is still on level 0.0001.
rmfr
It is still NOT AI. It is nothing more than a very sophisticated computer program executing programmed commands.
rmfr
Some scientific theories indicate that the universe is mathematics or numbers, so humans too, are perhaps nothing more than quite sophisticated "computer" programs. See "Max Tegmark's mathematical universe", or "Wikipedia/Digital Physics".
In fact, the field of Ai may be seen as being predicated on the reasoning that biological brains are nothing more than quite complicated machines, that can generate substrate independent general intelligence, i.e. general intelligence is not limited to biological stuff, but can be reasonably replicated in the form of inorganic stuff, namely artificial general intelligence.
@ arakish
"It is still NOT AI. It is nothing more than a very sophisticated computer program executing programmed commands."
Exactly.
For example one flaw in the Waymo is that it holds for a minimum of three seconds at any stop, regardless of the circumstances. If it had true intelligence, it would figure out that a hold of three seconds is not required, and shorten the time if possible.
Additionally, no Waymo car will travel to a region that has not been mapped (by the Waymo system) before. Countless passes must be made over every possible route to lay out rules to follow.
It is a sophisticate program, but nothing about it indicates it is actually using any intelligence, just following rules.
Just because some company proclaims that a product has AI, it may actually not be true.
I think it would be wise for you to visit this: The wired guide to self-driving cars
In fact, self driving cars demonstrably contain the ai I mentioned above, as well as other infrastructure, without which they couldn't identify objects in the environment well enough.
Yep. Definitely a Religious Absolutist who happens to have gone wonko over a never to exist AI.
rmfr
Waymo One (The video is simply hype produced by the company and not the reality.)
Waymo One is a taxi with a driver and not really much more at this point. The driver is there to rescue the car when it makes mistakes. There are no new customers, only the original experimental group is still using the cars and they are still using them in the original testing area. The technology is not yet ready to be released and that is just a fact. It may be released in the future but if you simply read between the lines you can see the difference between the facts and what the company is boasting.
I'm not arguing that it is not cool technology. Just saying there is a whole lot of hype and the hype is not real. The car is still experimental and still being studied. We have been doing these experiments for 20 years. "The man who invented the self-driving car (in 1986) Long before Big Tech got behind the wheel, Ernst Dickmanns unleashed a driverless Mercedes onto the roads of Europe."
https://www.politico.eu/article/delf-driving-car-born-1986-ernst-dickman...
All they are doing is allowing the Waymo to be on the streets while they continue testing, Onyl testers are allowed to use the vehicle. "You have to be in a very exclusive, 400-person club called the Early Riders."
"Waymo’s year-and-a-half-old focus group for its self-driving cars. To start out, Waymo’s new self-driving taxi service — dubbed “Waymo One” — will only be available to “several hundred” members of the Early Rider program, said Dan Chu, head of product at Waymo. That’s exclusivity within exclusivity."
"Since April 2017, the Early Riders have been testing the company’s autonomous vehicles for trips to work, school, and various errands. "
This is a study. It is not a release. The test subjects have been moved from the early test to Waymo One and can now be charged for rides. "WILL THEY BE WILLING TO PAY?" "Waymo declined to comment on how quickly it plans to open up its service to the rest of us. "
"The cars aren’t fully driverless yet: they will include “trained drivers” behind the steering wheel until Waymo decides to pull them out. Chu says it will test a variety of “configurations;” the company says it will eventually offer driverless rides, but it declined to give an exact date."
"While Waymo insists its cars will drive themselves a majority of the time, the human driver can take control should the vehicle become confused." We have seen the video, the car makes many significant mistakes that have the potential of causing accidents.
Waymo's released videos and claims are not the truth. Drivers behind the wheel and The video "trips occurred in just a small, largely residential portion of its service area, and they were never the majority of the rides provided by Waymo. According to a recent report in The Information, Waymo’s most advanced vehicles are still occasionally confounded by certain traffic situations, which suggests the tech — while incredibly advanced — is still not quite ready for the real world. "
https://www.theverge.com/2018/12/5/18126103/waymo-one-self-driving-taxi-...
In short - this has been going on for over 20 years and the cars are not ready for the public yet. Nothing was released. The study is continuing.
Your feelings are noted, but facts don't care about your feelings, nor the feelings of the reporter you linked.
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Also, cherry picking doesn't work here.
Let me complete one of your sentences:
What you quoted: "The cars aren’t fully driverless yet: they will include “trained drivers” behind the steering wheel until Waymo decides to pull them out."
The rest of the sentence: "the company says it will eventually offer driverless rides, but it declined to give an exact date."
The tech, like human drivers, is not perfect, but they have been tested now for years without drivers. They're not fully driverless, as they will ship the service with a driver in the driver's seat. This doesn't mean they can't perform without the driver, as they had already demonstrably done.
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I wonder if you'll note that regular non-self driving cars are also still being studied? Does this mean they have not yet been released? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Here's another vision for the future of driverless AI vehicles.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGi6j2VrL0o
¯\_(ツ)_/¯ ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@Avant Brown Stop assuming we are ignorant. We all know, or should, that drivers have a shitty record of staying accident free, overall. We all should know that self driving cars will not be perfect right out of the gate.
Also, as others have pointed out, Waymo's AI is nowhere close to being full AI, capable of navigating in every type of weather, on every road, or will actually truly make it's own decisions.
It's cool as shit, but there is no indication it is even close to being ready for public use. As for where I live, Waymo has a long path to providing me the service.
I think you've replaced god with AI. You practically worship it like one.
There's no indication, to a person that ignores evidence.
In reality though, I think you're confusing the self driving car's imperfection, for some false idea that it is not already demonstrably operational on public roads, having been tested for years without drivers too.
Avant Brown Stop assuming we are ignorant.
(I second this sentiment. Holey Hell is this guy dense or what?) THE CAR IS STILL IN ITS EXPERIMENTAL STAGES WITH THE ORIGINAL TEST GROUP,
YOU HAVE SEEN THE ARTICLES. IT IS NOT READY FOR THE ROAD YET
THE CAR STILL NEEDS A HUMAN DRIVER TO PULL IT OUT OF SHIT.
HOW FRIGGING DENSE ARE YOU?
BGBrainless: "Waymo has gotten permit to operate without people in driver's seat, and legislation has been passed, and it was launched publicly as a service, days ago."
But only in controlled "test track" conditions. And even then, it still has a driver in the right hand seat to pull it out of any stupid shit it does like turning on a turn signal then turning into a parked car. Yes, they are testing for level 3, but it still only ranks level 0.0001.
rmfr
Any citation that verifies that feeling of yours? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
The same one alluded to in an earlier post where the car turned on its turn signal then turned into a parked car.
rmfr
Read the fucking article. Same test subjects, Same test field. With a driver behind the wheel. In the same suburban area it has been practicing in for the past 10 years. How fking dense are you. (114) "The Legislature has made it possible for Autonomous Car manufacturers to TEST their cars on the streets. Waymo is the first to run these tests" (YOUR FUCKING VIDEO - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUFGRB7X4gI)
Do you know how to speak English? "In order for Waymo to TEST its cars in the Golden State (California) it must meet a lot more standards. 5 million dollar insurance policy, The company must be able to monitor the status of their test vehicles and passengers remotely and at all times (New The company has not done this before.), Trained operators are there (in the frigging car) to take over operation at any time.
"California has strict requirements before autonomous vehicles will be allowed to test on its roads. " What in the fk video are you watching. Do you know how to listen. Stop listening to the hype you are being sold and LISTEN TO THE FRIGGING WORDS.
1. I didn't mention that the launch didn't encompass the same test subjects, and the same test field.
2. What you say above regarding California, does not change that California granted them the permit to be tested without drivers.
Despite the reality that waymo one was actually launched to the same pool [that happens to consist of public citizens], ...your expressions propose that a launch cannot possibly include the same pool entailed in prior tests, why is that?
Why did California grant Waymo permit to test without drivers, if Waymo was supposedly "no where close" to being public ready as you would like to feel?
Please include citations in your responses. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
I'm much more impressed with Tesla's AI than Waymo's.
Waymo has to pre-plan every route. Tesla's AI utilizes no pre-planned route and works on nearly every freeway in the world.
Tesla is at best between level 2 and 3 autonomy, as far as data goes.
Waymo on the other hand, is reasonably between level 3 and 4 autonomy.
See Wikipedia/Self driving car.
Also, take a look at this crucial graph on Wikipedia/self driving car/Miles per disengagement
I don't give a shit if Waymo's AI is at a higher autonomy level. Waymo's business and AI strategy will not make a humongous splash. The pitfalls will make scaling it up nearly impossible.
Tesla's is more impressive because their strategy is to bring self driving to everyone, in every reasonable situation. Tesla does not have the same pitfalls as Waymo.
The database size needed to house the data, needed to preplan every route to every house in certain cities is staggering.
Waymo will either have to change away from pre-planned routes, setting them back, or keep their service small.
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